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OT: The Toronto Blue Jays

It's a shitty situation all around, but one that makes Shapiro look really bad.

Let's keep in mind;

1) It's safe to say that most people wanted to extend Donaldson.
2) It's safe to say that most people assumed Donaldson would be worth something at the deadline.
3) However, it's also safe to say that most people would have reluctantly accepted a preseason Donaldson trade if Shatkins was up front about how shitty the team actually was. This team competing was so heavily dependent on Donaldson being healthy and really good. There was no way for this roster to make up for a significant injury to Josh.

Now the Jays have..... nothing.

1) No extended Donaldson.
2) He wasn't worth anything at the deadline.
3) He wasn't traded for what now seems like a great package offered from the Cards.

This leads back to this. Shapiro has do nothing with this team, and this is a prime example. They have made no signature move and didn't get any return on major assets. I don't give a flying fukc about "good second and third tier" players they've picked up. They have been a terrible administration. They have been here going on 4 years now. No more fukcing excuses for this shit show.

And you know what --- Donaldson is gonna tear shit up the rest of the way.
 
I think most people here were of the opinion that if you are inevitably going to trade Donaldson (clearly always the plan), you do it at a point where you can maximize his value. And that point was either last year's deadline or this offseason.

Really the only justification for keeping him around was to try and trick the fans into forking over more money early in the season.

They devalued their best asset in order to try and generate slightly more revenues out of a shit season.

Granted, his health played a factor in this. But even a healthy Donaldson fetches a lesser return at this year's deadline than last year's or in the offseason.

I can't wait until Donaldson opens up about his time here and his interactions with management.
 
Especially with Machado also to be dealt, and without too many openings at 3b, we really should have been on the ball last offseason to deal him.
 
UWHabs said:
Especially with Machado also to be dealt, and without too many openings at 3b, we really should have been on the ball last offseason to deal him.
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Or build around him.

The excuse that we can't have a good team because Tulo and Martin are on it is bullshit. Shatkins has spent lots of money the last two years on "their own" players. Nearly 80 million on 2 WAR directly spent by Shatkins.
 
Are all teams so focused on nickeling and diming their controllable players as the Jays now are?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/m...rds-delayed-promotion-carries-future-savings/

While Alford certainly falls into the former category, by waiting an extra two weeks, the Blue Jays also limited the chances that he eventually qualifies as a Super Two player for arbitration should he eventually play two full seasons in the majors.

Typically, players require three full years of service time (172 days on the 25-man roster equals a full year) to qualify for arbitration, the process through which they escalate their earnings prior to free agency. But under the collective bargaining, the top 22 per cent of players between two and three years of service time qualify for arbitration a year early as a Super Two.

That’s important because Super Two players become eligible for arbitration four times, rather than three, before entering free agency, which spikes the salaries of premium players because they continually platform off a higher number.

The number of days needed to qualify for Super Two status varies from year-to-year but usually falls between two years 120 days, or 2.120, and 2.150. Last year, it was 2.123 while in 2016 it was 2.131.

Alford earned 68 days of service time last year and earlier this year picked up 24 when he opened the season on the disabled list, and then nine more during a brief call-up in May, pushing his total to 101.
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They seem way more interested in not paying player's in a bunch of years, at the risk of not developing them properly now.

Play someone at the level their quality suggests they should play at. These guys treat players turning out to be good as a bad thing ffs. Oh, we don't want these kids getting too good, too quickly, they might cost us money!!
 
They seem way more interested in not paying player's in a bunch of years, at the risk of not developing them properly now.

Play someone at the level their quality suggests they should play at. These guys treat players turning out to be good as a bad thing ffs. Oh, we don't want these kids getting too good, too quickly, they might cost us money!!
 
CaptainBolduke said:
Or build around him.

The excuse that we can't have a good team because Tulo and Martin are on it is bullshit. Shatkins has spent lots of money the last two years on "their own" players. Nearly 80 million on 2 WAR directly spent by Shatkins.
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You dont build around 33 year old beat up players like JD on a team that needs 2-3 years of rebuilding .

This was purely Rogers wanting the cash register to keep spitting money and squashing any retool .
 
GEEMAN said:
You dont build around 33 year old beat up players like JD on a team that needs 2-3 years of rebuilding .

This was purely Rogers wanting the cash register to keep spitting money and squashing any retool .
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Yeah, if you can get him "cheap enough" (ie. around the 3/75 mark) it would have been worth it to keep him around if we had signed that before the year. But more than that, especially with the #1 prospect in the game coming up and playing the same position, you don't offer more.

The problem obviously is that everything went downhill with JD, and management was too chickenshit to deal him before the season. I mean, I could have understood it if the only offers we were getting last winter was the Gorko+Carpenter deal that Fangraphs proposed last fall, then maybe I understand not being enthusiastic about that. But if the Cards offer was Flaherty, who is just about exactly what the team needs long term to truly be able to match up with the big guys in a couple years, that's virtually inexcusable to not pull the trigger on.
 
UWHabs said:
Yeah, if you can get him "cheap enough" (ie. around the 3/75 mark) it would have been worth it to keep him around if we had signed that before the year. But more than that, especially with the #1 prospect in the game coming up and playing the same position, you don't offer more.

The problem obviously is that everything went downhill with JD, and management was too chickenshit to deal him before the season. I mean, I could have understood it if the only offers we were getting last winter was the Gorko+Carpenter deal that Fangraphs proposed last fall, then maybe I understand not being enthusiastic about that. But if the Cards offer was Flaherty, who is just about exactly what the team needs long term to truly be able to match up with the big guys in a couple years, that's virtually inexcusable to not pull the trigger on.
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Who knows what goes on behind the scenes or what was offered. There was a report a few weeks ago our offer was in the same 3 year ballpark of $ 75 mil but was turned down.

This came down to money plain and simple. JD wanted term and big coin and we didnt go that route.

He was losing his job to Vlad and he wasn’t signing a QO , not a chance .

He will be getting plenty of suitors offering a minimum of 1 year with bonuses on better teams .
 
CaptainBolduke said:
Both Josh and his agent denied that. So it looks like GEEMAN is spreading fake news.
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Both sides play with the narratives. Most likely, as they were talking last winter, the Jays talked to JD's camp and asked him something like "Hey, would you guys at all be interested in signing for a deal like the one Arrieta just signed?" And JD replied "Nah, we want a larger guarantee than that." and that was that. So no, the Jays in all likelihood never physically gave a paper for JD to sign, but I'm sure they both knew where each side stood. JD was probably looking for 100+ on a 3-5 year deal, the Jays weren't willing to go more than 3 years and weren't willing to make it up with a larger AAV.
 
Not sure if Blair was deep into the cocktails last night or not but:

SNJeffBlair

John Farrell returning to manage the Blue Jays would be spectacular.

Farrell in ’19: He’s Tanned, Rested and Ready!

Y’all think I’m joking about Farrell …. Heh heh heh ...
 
UWHabs said:
Both sides play with the narratives. Most likely, as they were talking last winter, the Jays talked to JD's camp and asked him something like "Hey, would you guys at all be interested in signing for a deal like the one Arrieta just signed?" And JD replied "Nah, we want a larger guarantee than that." and that was that. So no, the Jays in all likelihood never physically gave a paper for JD to sign, but I'm sure they both knew where each side stood. JD was probably looking for 100+ on a 3-5 year deal, the Jays weren't willing to go more than 3 years and weren't willing to make it up with a larger AAV.
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Good luck getting that 3 year deal now . Might be another Joey Bats blunder by the player.
 
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