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OT: Politics & News... Have at it.

And now we have video of the cops in Cleveland killing a 12 year old boy. Model gun obviously an issue, but again I question their competency, training, and protocols for engagement.

The blame game is utterly futile, so the conversation has to focus on problem solving instead of recriminations. But, geezus, the end result is wildly disproportionate with the actual situation.
 
Sal_Butera said:
No white person can ever understand the complexities related to (overt/subtle) racism, so I'm never get why so many try to talk as if they have any understanding of it.

U've never lived in the US, but think u understand how the game works - it's not Canada, it's a completely different culture when it comes to addressing criminal acts/violence.
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So beheadings are fine because that is how the game works ?

But yes the US is different in a lot of ways...and is wrong.

This Brown death is not nearly as bad as the Zimmerman thing.
 
I think some here are missing the point that if you file a civil lawsuit, or if you are the gov't and want to prosecute someone criminally, you are not automatically allowed to get to trial and have the jury decide. The court/system will act as a gatekeeper long before trial and dismiss cases that it feels lacks sufficient evidence to proceed so that the jury would just be deciding based on its "gut feeling," like Xpo apparently advocates. I guess you can debate if there was enough evidence here but given that it's clear (to me, at least) that there was obvious reasonable doubt and there would never be a conviction, the decision of the grand jury not to indict was 100% correct.
 
Rolex said:
I think most people regret the fact it ended up in a human being dying....and when someone dies, people are allowed to ask questions and demand answers.

Unfortunately, there was not enough evidence to put a person in jail for the rest of his life. Would you feel comfortable sentencing the cop to 20 years in prison without sufficient evidence ?

If the kid that died was your son or family, you'd sentence the cop without even looking at the evidence. At the end of the day, the lack of concrete witnessed details led to the cop walking (whether he's truly innocent or guilty).

I feel bad for Brown's family, as they will not have peace....at least if there was good evidence to backup the decision, it would have helped them grieve...
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If it was a one off I do not think people would care.
 
lecoqsportif said:
And now we have video of the cops in Cleveland killing a 12 year old boy. Model gun obviously an issue, but again I question their competency, training, and protocols for engagement.

The blame game is utterly futile, so the conversation has to focus on problem solving instead of recriminations. But, geezus, the end result is wildly disproportionate with the actual situation.
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From what I'm reading on this....

It starts with a passerby calling 911 to report this kid waving a gun around, the passerby apparently told the 911 operator that the gun was probably fake or a toy.....the 911 operator fails to relay that info to the cops.....and then from what the video shows, the cruiser pulls up to the child, cops get out....and they shoot pretty quickly.

Outrage here might be well placed.
 
"It's probably fake, but you know what, it's scaring the [expletive] out of me," the caller said.

"He's pulling it in and out of his pants, and pointing it at people. He's probably a juvenile," he added. The caller then left the area.

Soon after, a police dispatcher called officers to the scene, but didn't mention the 911 caller's suspicion that the gun might be fake.

"In the park by the youth center, there's a black male sitting on the swings. He's wearing a camouflage hat, a gray jacket with black sleeves. He keeps pulling a gun out of his pants and pointing it at people," the dispatcher said.

Authorities initially declined to release the video, but announced yesterday it would be made public at the request of Rice's family.
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http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cleveland-officer-shot-tamir-rice-within-seconds-of-pulling-up-in-patrol-car/
 
xposbrad said:
What about for assaulting a police officer and trying to grab his gun? I mean, no one really knows what happened. The police officer could be lying, or he could be telling the truth, right. I think after this, the best thing is, cops have cameras built into their clothes, that's it. That way, if in fact this 300 pound kid was trying to punch the officer and charging him and everyone saw it, there would be no riots and we'd have 170 cities without protests.
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Have you seen the photos of the injuries to the police officer taken at the hospital..... i get worse injuries shaving.

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1) Wilson claimed the punches were thrown through the car window... with Brown's right hand.... and with Wilson in the driver seat. (Take a moment. Picture that scene.... Right hand throwing punches through an open car window at someone in the driver's seat).
Now explain why all of thse very minor injuries are on the right side of Wilson's face.

2) Wilson described himself as 6'4 210 lbs. He is one inch shorter than Brown. He said when he was holding brown's arm it was "like a 5-year old trying to hold onto hulk hogan". Said he thought that Brown's third punch could kill him if it landed. Look again at the injuries of the first two punches.

3) Wilson called Brown a "Demon". Also referred to him as "it" in one portion of his testimony. Said he saw a cloud of dust rising as Brown charged at him and claims that Brown was “almost bulking up to run through the shots” "as if each shot was making him madder" as if this young black man was literally the Incredible Hulk or some sort of inhuman monster.

4) There are no official police photographs of the body because supposedly the photographer forgot to charge his batteries. And Wilson’s story hinges on a call in to dispatch that, somehow, dispatch just magically never got.

5) Brown died 150 feet from the car where the initial (alleged) fist fight took place. 150 feet away..... Do you think Brown might have been running away at some point?

6) Multiple eye witnesses claim Brown had his hands up when shot not once, not twice... not three times.... but 6 bullets entered his body.... Wilson fired 10 times.

The only person who claims that Brown was charging at him is Wilson. No other eyewitness describes Brown charging at him.

Is firing on a man 10 times, and hitting him six times, including twice in the head... a reasonable amount of force to use given the injuries Wilson sustained?

7) Wilson claims Brown had his hand in his waistband, his head down, and was charging at him.... close your eyes and picture that.... hand in the waistband, al bundy style.... head down.... charging straight ahead.

Seriously???? Seriously???????? YOu expect me to believe that is how the kid is running at you?

These questions all should have been asked by a competent prosecutor....
These questions all should be brought to trial.
Its clear to me anyway that Wilson is a LIAR.

Would this alone guarantee a conviction beyond reasonable doubt? NO. Such a conviction would still be an uphill battle.

But at the very least, the Brown family deserved their day in court. Deserved a trial here. There is simply too many inconsistencies in Wilson's statments.... too many eyewitnesses who say he shot a boy in cold blood, to not put that to a trial of the evidence.
 
northernlou said:
the reaction is what it is, a conflation imo. Brown's attitude, call it what you will....did him in.
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"Attitude", eh?

Yep, apparently it's a capital crime punishable by death to be "uppity". I guess Brown forgot his place. He thought he was "house" but was, in fact, just "field". He also probably forgot to take his hat off before addressing the officer.
 
you're an angry sort aren't you? Twisting my words to fuel your narrative.

No I don't think it's okay to be shot for attitude alone, however Michael Brown's attitude led to his actions that had him bust the window of the patrol car, reach in, attack a cop and go for his gun.
 
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