OT: American Politics
- Thread starter MindzEye
- Start date
LeafGm
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Either:
A) Harper has known all along that Novak and other senior members of the PMO were in the loop on this, and has blatantly lied for the past couple of years whenever he's been questioned on this.
B) Harper didn't know that Novak was in the loop on this because Novak's been lying to him about it for the past couple of years...whick is A-OK, apparently, because he's still got his job.
Or, the official story:
C) Novak was sent an e-mail from his then-boss about an issue that was of pre-eminent concern to the PMO at the time, but for some reason never bothered to open it.
Surely you can connect the dots?
Either:
A) Harper has known all along that Novak and other senior members of the PMO were in the loop on this, and has blatantly lied for the past couple of years whenever he's been questioned on this.
B) Harper didn't know that Novak was in the loop on this because Novak's been lying to him about it for the past couple of years...whick is A-OK, apparently, because he's still got his job.
Or, the official story:
C) Novak was sent an e-mail from his then-boss about an issue that was of pre-eminent concern to the PMO at the time, but for some reason never bothered to open it.
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
If Partisanhacksens thinks this is nothing, why is he spending so much time discussing it?
If Partisanhacksens thinks this is nothing, why is he spending so much time discussing it?
anne25
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
So what? Whether he did or didn't read them or who in the PMO office knew that Wright had paid the debt is immaterial.
The R.C.M.P and the auditors found that there was cause to charge Duffy for fudging his expenses. He will be found guilty or not guilty of that accusation. Who knew that Duffy did not use his own money to repay what was supposedly owed is not, as far as I know, part of the criminal charge. Yet that is all Duffy's lawyer and the media seem to be concern about. Duffy is either guilty or he is not. No one else is on trial.
So what? Whether he did or didn't read them or who in the PMO office knew that Wright had paid the debt is immaterial.
The R.C.M.P and the auditors found that there was cause to charge Duffy for fudging his expenses. He will be found guilty or not guilty of that accusation. Who knew that Duffy did not use his own money to repay what was supposedly owed is not, as far as I know, part of the criminal charge. Yet that is all Duffy's lawyer and the media seem to be concern about. Duffy is either guilty or he is not. No one else is on trial.
anne25
Well-known member
IrishWolfman
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
I think - and I want to stipulate, I think - the argument around Duffy is hinging on this: when confronted with Duffy's wrongdoing, the PMO's instinct was to cover it up rather than hang Duffy out to dry.
Imagine this: Duffy goes to Nigel Wright and says "This is what happened, this is how much I owe" and, rather than trying to help Duffy out or cover up the expenses, Wright says "tough luck, Duff". Wright then calls the Leader of the Government in the Senate and requests that the Conservative caucus in the Senate to convene a vote to expel Duffy from caucus.
If Wright does that, rather than what he actually did, does anyone imagine this is a story?
The issue with Wright and the PMO isn't what Duffy did, it's that it looks like they tried to cover up what Duffy did.
I think - and I want to stipulate, I think - the argument around Duffy is hinging on this: when confronted with Duffy's wrongdoing, the PMO's instinct was to cover it up rather than hang Duffy out to dry.
Imagine this: Duffy goes to Nigel Wright and says "This is what happened, this is how much I owe" and, rather than trying to help Duffy out or cover up the expenses, Wright says "tough luck, Duff". Wright then calls the Leader of the Government in the Senate and requests that the Conservative caucus in the Senate to convene a vote to expel Duffy from caucus.
If Wright does that, rather than what he actually did, does anyone imagine this is a story?
The issue with Wright and the PMO isn't what Duffy did, it's that it looks like they tried to cover up what Duffy did.
corksens
Legend
corksens
Legend
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Just read the headline in that article. Look how carefully crafted it is as to look as good as possible. It's not about the fact that she said those disgusting things, it's about her apology and then some rationale as she was a "teenager".
It's a joke.
Just read the headline in that article. Look how carefully crafted it is as to look as good as possible. It's not about the fact that she said those disgusting things, it's about her apology and then some rationale as she was a "teenager".
It's a joke.
IrishWolfman
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
I don't think either of these is news.
1 is an excuse for the media to cover itself.
2 isn't a story because if we held all candidates, particularly one that is as incredibly unlikely to win as this one, accountable for shit they said as teenagers, no one would ever be able to run for political office ever again.
I don't think either of these is news.
1 is an excuse for the media to cover itself.
2 isn't a story because if we held all candidates, particularly one that is as incredibly unlikely to win as this one, accountable for shit they said as teenagers, no one would ever be able to run for political office ever again.
UWHabs
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Yeah, that's the problem with the Duffy stuff for the Cons. If they just ignored him, or let him do whatever, then he'd just turn into another Mac Harb. The issue is that when confronted with the case, it certainly appears that there were people who tried to cover up the Duffy issue, and the more we learn, the higher up in the PMO it goes. And not just that it seems to go high up, but all along Harper has maintained that the people close to him did nothing wrong, weren't involved, knew nothing, etc... whereas now it seems like they at least knew everything, and almost to the point of Harper himself being involved in meetings to figure out what to do.
And then never mind how high it went, the fact that Harper only denounced Wright long as he'd quit, and long after the initial stuff broke. If he had publicly fired him when the payment first surfaced, then a lot of this would have stuck less on Harper, since then he could realistically claim that it was a lone gunman. But the fact that it took him so long to turn on Wright makes it look more like he initially had nothing wrong with his conduct, but only changed his mind when the polls told him he had to.
Yeah, that's the problem with the Duffy stuff for the Cons. If they just ignored him, or let him do whatever, then he'd just turn into another Mac Harb. The issue is that when confronted with the case, it certainly appears that there were people who tried to cover up the Duffy issue, and the more we learn, the higher up in the PMO it goes. And not just that it seems to go high up, but all along Harper has maintained that the people close to him did nothing wrong, weren't involved, knew nothing, etc... whereas now it seems like they at least knew everything, and almost to the point of Harper himself being involved in meetings to figure out what to do.
And then never mind how high it went, the fact that Harper only denounced Wright long as he'd quit, and long after the initial stuff broke. If he had publicly fired him when the payment first surfaced, then a lot of this would have stuck less on Harper, since then he could realistically claim that it was a lone gunman. But the fact that it took him so long to turn on Wright makes it look more like he initially had nothing wrong with his conduct, but only changed his mind when the polls told him he had to.
corksens
Legend
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
We can downplay it as stuff said as a teenager - but she wrote those words less than 4 years ago. It's news...and it would have been pounced on months ago if it were a Conservative.
IrishWolfman
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Okay, I have to admit, I'm a little sick of how insecure my fellow conservatives can sometimes be.
a) she said it four years ago....when she was 17. My previous point stands.
b) she's going to get killed by Michelle Rempel in that riding, there's no risk this person actually gets elected. That's probably the reason no one bothered looking until now
c) the media applied the appropriate amount of scrutiny, they asked Justin Trudeau about the tweets.
There is no grand conspiracy. There's an entirely logical explanation for literally everything that occurred in this instance.
These literally aren't the mother****ing droids you're looking for!
Okay, I have to admit, I'm a little sick of how insecure my fellow conservatives can sometimes be.
a) she said it four years ago....when she was 17. My previous point stands.
b) she's going to get killed by Michelle Rempel in that riding, there's no risk this person actually gets elected. That's probably the reason no one bothered looking until now
c) the media applied the appropriate amount of scrutiny, they asked Justin Trudeau about the tweets.
There is no grand conspiracy. There's an entirely logical explanation for literally everything that occurred in this instance.
These literally aren't the mother****ing droids you're looking for!
blacksheep
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Because, as we all know, there is nothing the Cons could do that would in any way be construed as wrong or against any law. They are all gods and walk on water. They are the saviours of his watch collection, and he will defend them, no matter what, right to the bitter end.
The Tories can do no wrong. © 2005 Corksens
Because, as we all know, there is nothing the Cons could do that would in any way be construed as wrong or against any law. They are all gods and walk on water. They are the saviours of his watch collection, and he will defend them, no matter what, right to the bitter end.
The Tories can do no wrong. © 2005 Corksens
LeafGm
Well-known member
corksens
Legend
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
The point is I am trying to get you to complete your thoughts. When you actually say what the problem is out loud it's far more trivial...
blacksheep
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
The Tories can do no wrong. © 2005 Corksens
The Tories can do no wrong. © 2005 Corksens
UWHabs
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
True. The PM lying about people in his office's involvement in an illegal payment scheme really is not a big deal.
True. The PM lying about people in his office's involvement in an illegal payment scheme really is not a big deal.
MindzEye
Wayward Ditch Pig
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
All of which is entirely in character with how Harper manages the PMO....which is a major reason why people who pay attention have never bought the idea of him not knowing.
All of which is entirely in character with how Harper manages the PMO....which is a major reason why people who pay attention have never bought the idea of him not knowing.