OT: American Politics
- Thread starter MindzEye
- Start date
mbow30
Spudmeister Supreme
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
i can bring a pretty unique perspective here - i work in the private sector but have spent the past 2 months working with government and in government offices.
the 9-5 thing is just incorrect. yes, there are abusers, but by and large:
(1) support staff (admin) work 9-5 -- but they also generally work 9-5 in the private sector.
(2) a lot of people on the policy side work crazy hours, especially when drafting.
(3) you have to create inducements to get smart people to work for government. it's in our interest to have bright people making, implementing and enforcing policy. government simply can't afford to pay commensurate with the private sector. if the private sector would pay out $500k, why would you accept a job in government at $150k?
these people aren't riding the gravy train. they work hard. but you aren't going to attract top people from the private sector for a 50+% pay cut on 100 hour weeks.
i can bring a pretty unique perspective here - i work in the private sector but have spent the past 2 months working with government and in government offices.
the 9-5 thing is just incorrect. yes, there are abusers, but by and large:
(1) support staff (admin) work 9-5 -- but they also generally work 9-5 in the private sector.
(2) a lot of people on the policy side work crazy hours, especially when drafting.
(3) you have to create inducements to get smart people to work for government. it's in our interest to have bright people making, implementing and enforcing policy. government simply can't afford to pay commensurate with the private sector. if the private sector would pay out $500k, why would you accept a job in government at $150k?
these people aren't riding the gravy train. they work hard. but you aren't going to attract top people from the private sector for a 50+% pay cut on 100 hour weeks.
mbow30
Spudmeister Supreme
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
there are big problems with looking at that data in the aggregate.
first, it includes people with high risk jobs who really don't have a comparable in the private sector (police, fire, EMS). it also includes teachers, where the public sector has to compete with the private sector.
in terms of the high-skill bureaucrats in key positions, though -- aboslutely, 100% they take a pay hit. a very, very substantial one.
there are big problems with looking at that data in the aggregate.
first, it includes people with high risk jobs who really don't have a comparable in the private sector (police, fire, EMS). it also includes teachers, where the public sector has to compete with the private sector.
in terms of the high-skill bureaucrats in key positions, though -- aboslutely, 100% they take a pay hit. a very, very substantial one.
CaptainBolduke
Active member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
No one in my office works 9-5. I myself work 730-6 most days. I'm in communications/media, not policy.
Unless you become the head of a major entity, you'll never be a rich from working in the OPS.
No one in my office works 9-5. I myself work 730-6 most days. I'm in communications/media, not policy.
Unless you become the head of a major entity, you'll never be a rich from working in the OPS.
corksens
Legend
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
The report specifically excluded those jobs without comparable private sector equivalents.
runninglow
Active member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Many professionals (engineer, planner, lawyer, etc) take substantial pay cuts going from private to public. I took a 35% haircut when I did it. And as was mentioned above, there are those that milk the system...happens in private corporations too...but the majority are hard working people, and many positions are not 9-5, requiring extra, unpaid hours.
Many professionals (engineer, planner, lawyer, etc) take substantial pay cuts going from private to public. I took a 35% haircut when I did it. And as was mentioned above, there are those that milk the system...happens in private corporations too...but the majority are hard working people, and many positions are not 9-5, requiring extra, unpaid hours.
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
He backed off but hasn't said he wouldn't do it if elected.
He backed off but hasn't said he wouldn't do it if elected.
blacksheep
New member
blacksheep
New member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Since when?
The Big Three are on a two-tier pay system, and many of their suppliers are quickly following suit. If you've been in that job for more than 20yrs, you're still at that "significantly more than minimum wage" bracket. The rest... make slightly more than minimum wage.
Have you noticed the cost of cars going down? Me neither. So where's the savings going?
Also, as already mentioned, manufacturing jobs are quickly disappearing altogether. The biggest reason is our dollar being at par with theirs since about 2008. Once an investor loses that advantage, the plant goes overseas.
Won't be long before Chrysler closes it's last two remaining assembly plants in Ontario and heads to South Korea. Free Trade, here we come!
So what's left for jobs? Well... there's a new Target store in town... and Walmart is hiring...
Since when?
The Big Three are on a two-tier pay system, and many of their suppliers are quickly following suit. If you've been in that job for more than 20yrs, you're still at that "significantly more than minimum wage" bracket. The rest... make slightly more than minimum wage.
Have you noticed the cost of cars going down? Me neither. So where's the savings going?
Also, as already mentioned, manufacturing jobs are quickly disappearing altogether. The biggest reason is our dollar being at par with theirs since about 2008. Once an investor loses that advantage, the plant goes overseas.
Won't be long before Chrysler closes it's last two remaining assembly plants in Ontario and heads to South Korea. Free Trade, here we come!
So what's left for jobs? Well... there's a new Target store in town... and Walmart is hiring...
CaptainBolduke
Active member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
What new manufactuing jobs? Unless we attract some sector i've never heard of before?
The only thing we have in the pipeline is mining and the maufacturing that comes from it. That's currently being worked on. Taking a step back on that would be idiotic. We've build the relationships with the First Nations, and we need to keep the main players involved.
What new manufactuing jobs? Unless we attract some sector i've never heard of before?
The only thing we have in the pipeline is mining and the maufacturing that comes from it. That's currently being worked on. Taking a step back on that would be idiotic. We've build the relationships with the First Nations, and we need to keep the main players involved.
CaptainBolduke
Active member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
They don't get pensions. Harris got rid of them in the late 1990's. Regardless of what party they're in, Ontario MPP's don't get a pensions. It's one of the reasons why you see members in there 70's hanging around.
They don't get pensions. Harris got rid of them in the late 1990's. Regardless of what party they're in, Ontario MPP's don't get a pensions. It's one of the reasons why you see members in there 70's hanging around.
Last edited:
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Cut them, use the money for all day two way service on the go and to build the east west relief subway line, as well as extend the sheppard subway to STC.
Cut them, use the money for all day two way service on the go and to build the east west relief subway line, as well as extend the sheppard subway to STC.
Deckie007
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
I actually don't hate that, but Northern Toronto is horribly underserved and that needs to be fixed.
I actually don't hate that, but Northern Toronto is horribly underserved and that needs to be fixed.
LeafGm
Well-known member
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Build the relief line first, and then you'll have the extra capacity to start expanding service into outlying areas.
It's true, but building lines out to Scarborough, Etobicoke, North York or Richmond Hill isn't going to help if they don't address the congestion that already exists on the main lines. In rush hour downtown, all the subway cars already have people jammed into every cubic foot like sardines, so where are we going to fit all of these additional riders?
Build the relief line first, and then you'll have the extra capacity to start expanding service into outlying areas.
Re: OT: Canadian Politics
Sheppard extension doesn't make much sense. It's also screwing Toronto's transit infrastructure for everyone north of the 401.
I'm not certain about his east west relief line idea, need more information on it and the proposed routing.
He's also screwing parts of the 905 that need transit infrastructure badly.
I'm also annoyed that he wants to scrap the electrification of the go network. Which is something that is desperately needed.
Sheppard extension doesn't make much sense. It's also screwing Toronto's transit infrastructure for everyone north of the 401.
I'm not certain about his east west relief line idea, need more information on it and the proposed routing.
He's also screwing parts of the 905 that need transit infrastructure badly.
I'm also annoyed that he wants to scrap the electrification of the go network. Which is something that is desperately needed.