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2014-15 Miscellaneous League News and Discussions

Datsyuk is also hurt, he is going to miss 4-5 weeks. Bad week for Metro centers. If I was Pittsburgh I would keep Crosby and Malkin home and in bubble wrap for the rest of the preseason.
 
cmaleski2 said:
Datsyuk is also hurt, he is going to miss 4-5 weeks. Bad week for Metro centers. If I was Pittsburgh I would keep Crosby and Malkin home and in bubble wrap for the rest of the preseason.
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Derek Stepan's leg is broken as well- fibula...
 
Interesting read here on the Flyers rebuilding and Hextall as new GM.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/preview2014/...lyers-gm-ron-hextall-bringing-winning-formula

Two things that struck me in the article that the Canes could learn from:

1) Talk of player development, minor facilities, and resources -- In a cap system, "I don't know if you can ever be good enough" at drafting and developing your assets, Hextall said.

2) About Hextall himself putting in work to become increase knowledge and experience off-ice -- Some ex-players are not prepared to put in the hours to be successful off the ice, especially guys who have been stars, Futa said. That isn't the case with Hextall.

The first point is something we all crave around here, but the second point I think is very interesting. Most of the ex-Canes who are with the organization move straight into cushy organizational jobs that are still mostly based in Raleigh where they live. They are handed the jobs. I think it is great to see some guys like Hextall really want to learn and gain different perspectives so they take jobs that put them on the road or in different cities/organizations. Having outside perspectives and struggles to learn from is a great skill and knowledge base.

In Carolina it is too easy for the guys like Brindy and Francis. They had each said in past they really didn't want to be on the road and travel. I can't blame them as I probably wouldn't either after spending so much of your career on the road away from family. They each earned the right not to travel...but that doesn't mean they should be handed top level jobs either. The only good thing I see is maybe Francis recognizes these values and that is what led to hiring of Peters.
 
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Two guys I'll never criticize as not putting in the effort are Francis and Brind'Amour. I do believe neither guy would have accepted their current positions if they hadn't felt prepared- I've never questioned their work ethic. I do think both worked their way up. Certainly would have liked more "outside experience" from RF, but he put in his time in a variety of roles in the front office and his move to GM certainly showed progressions. Same with Brindy finally getting behind the bence. BTW, Brindy is responsible for the power play and so far so good. However, when it comes to Stillman and Wesley I am flumoxed as to what they do...
 
CarolinaPen said:
In Carolina it is too easy for the guys like Brindy and Francis. They had each said in past they really didn't want to be on the road and travel. I can't blame them as I probably wouldn't either after spending so much of your career on the road away from family. They each earned the right not to travel...but that doesn't mean they should be handed top level jobs either. The only good thing I see is maybe Francis recognizes these values and that is what led to hiring of Peters.
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Yeah ... not sure that's really fair to either one of them. Both Francis and Brind'Amour have had a variety of roles within the organization and have had different levels of responsibility. I think their willingness to put in the time to learn the craft associated with their jobs has varied with what jobs they were pegged in at the time.

Now. If you want to take a swing at some of these ill-defined player personnel jobs we have guys like Stillman and Welsey doing ... yeah. There's some room for criticism there. But even then, I really have no idea what their job descriptions are, what they're being paid or what anybody is even expecting out of their work. IMO it's fine to keep former players around the shop in largely ceremonial roles so long as somebody else is doing the heavy lifting and you're not paying them much. Nobody with the Canes organization has ever been real forthcoming about what's going on with those guys. A lot of NHL clubs have former players hanging around their scouting departments doing not a lot of anything other than going to games. It varies with the teams and the individuals.
 
jeffbear said:
Yeah ... not sure that's really fair to either one of them. Both Francis and Brind'Amour have had a variety of roles within the organization and have had different levels of responsibility. I think their willingness to put in the time to learn the craft associated with their jobs has varied with what jobs they were pegged in at the time.

Now. If you want to take a swing at some of these ill-defined player personnel jobs we have guys like Stillman and Welsey doing ... yeah. There's some room for criticism there. But even then, I really have no idea what their job descriptions are, what they're being paid or what anybody is even expecting out of their work. IMO it's fine to keep former players around the shop in largely ceremonial roles so long as somebody else is doing the heavy lifting and you're not paying them much. Nobody with the Canes organization has ever been real forthcoming about what's going on with those guys. A lot of NHL clubs have former players hanging around their scouting departments doing not a lot of anything other than going to games. It varies with the teams and the individuals.
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Yep. To me, as "devlopment directors", Wesley and Stillman should have rarely been in Raleigh. But when the Canes box was below 328-329, Wesley was almost always there. With the AHL playing almost exclusively on weekends, shouldn't they be spending a lot of weekdays with them? And if not there, hitting the guys still in college or juniors. I guess they could be at a practice in Charlotte in the morning and a game in Raleigh in the afternoon but it just seemed like they were in the wrong place.
 
I think the real issue for fans is that those roles have never been clearly defined so we have no idea of what's expected or even being paid for. I mean, for all we know they only expect a couple of hours a week of real work and are paying those two in game tickets. Who the heck knows?
 
jeffbear said:
Yeah ... not sure that's really fair to either one of them. Both Francis and Brind'Amour have had a variety of roles within the organization and have had different levels of responsibility. I think their willingness to put in the time to learn the craft associated with their jobs has varied with what jobs they were pegged in at the time.

Now. If you want to take a swing at some of these ill-defined player personnel jobs we have guys like Stillman and Welsey doing ... yeah. There's some room for criticism there. But even then, I really have no idea what their job descriptions are, what they're being paid or what anybody is even expecting out of their work. IMO it's fine to keep former players around the shop in largely ceremonial roles so long as somebody else is doing the heavy lifting and you're not paying them much. Nobody with the Canes organization has ever been real forthcoming about what's going on with those guys. A lot of NHL clubs have former players hanging around their scouting departments doing not a lot of anything other than going to games. It varies with the teams and the individuals.
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I am not saying Francis (or Brindy) haven't put some work in, they have to a certain extent. I think they were handed some opportunities because of the "franchise greats tag" they clearly earned during their career that probably didn't translate well into the immediate front office stature. My original point was to contrast the paths they took versus Hextall in the linked article. They are clearly very different and I think Hextall's path will be more beneficial to the Flyers in the long run versus say Francis's path with the Canes.

Looking back at what LA did before they began to see success you see major changes to player development, minor league infrastructure, etc. that helped lead them to future success. LA gutted the entire philosophy and system regarding player dev and rebooted around 2006 when Lombardi came on board. Hextall learned from that system. Contrast that to the Canes and Francis (who was in Director of Player Development/Personell roles during similar time period) and I see an organization and staff that has been on auto pilot far too long. The Canes systems recycles players, coaches, and usually takes the easy path.

I will give Francis the benefit of the doubt as he hasn't been GM long enough to really establish a history and I am hoping for the best. That said if you were a betting man, are you thinking major organizational changes that will lead to a different future or more of the same old, same old? What did he learn coming up in the Front Office?
 
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It's not only what he learned, it's also who he learned from.
These iPads and iOS 8 Really suck. I swear apple has gone down the drain.
 
Part of the reason RF hired Joe Nieuwendyke as a scout is also to have access to an advisor who has come up through the ranks, worked in different organizations, but is not part of the familia.
 
CarolinaPen said:
I will give Francis the benefit of the doubt as he hasn't been GM long enough to really establish a history and I am hoping for the best. That said if you were a betting man, are you thinking major organizational changes that will lead to a different future or more of the same old, same old? What did he learn coming up in the Front Office?
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Well. I keep saying this, but I'm going to wait and see what Ronnie actually does over time in the GM's chair before I start throwing out "same old same old" charges. And personally, I think the emotional damage done to the fan base by Rutherford over the last five years is going to take awhile to go away. It's kind of like we've been held hostage by Jimmy's twisted version of reality for so long that we are compelled to judge everything through that lens. I'm trying hard to break myself of translating everything that comes out of the Canes office through my Rutherford filter. I got pretty good at reading his BS, and now I'm trying to unlearn it.
 
jeffbear said:
Well. I keep saying this, but I'm going to wait and see what Ronnie actually does over time in the GM's chair before I start throwing out "same old same old" charges. And personally, I think the emotional damage done to the fan base by Rutherford over the last five years is going to take awhile to go away. It's kind of like we've been held hostage by Jimmy's twisted version of reality for so long that we are compelled to judge everything through that lens. I'm trying hard to break myself of translating everything that comes out of the Canes office through my Rutherford filter. I got pretty good at reading his BS, and now I'm trying to unlearn it.
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+1

I also find myself trying real hard to break the Rutherford twisted version of reality around here! Everyone deserves time to establish themselves in a new job, and what Francis has to fix is a big project overall and nobody can do that in one season!
 
CanadaCanes said:
+1

I also find myself trying real hard to break the Rutherford twisted version of reality around here! Everyone deserves time to establish themselves in a new job, and what Francis has to fix is a big project overall and nobody can do that in one season!
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And because Rutherford wasn't a complete idiot, SOME of what Ronnie will end up doing will look like things that Jimmy did. We need to start evaluating moves based on whether they make sense, not whether or not they remind of Rutherford as a pure pejorative. Rutherford DID win a Cup, so he did do a few things right along the way.
 
I still find it curious that all of the pundits thinks we will finish dead last in the division. Sorry folks, but this team is not THAT bad, even with Jordan out for 4 months. New coach, new direction, same players. This is a 84-90 point team, I think its laughable that so many folks think otherwise and have us a total train wreck.
 
cmaleski2 said:
I still find it curious that all of the pundits thinks we will finish dead last in the division. Sorry folks, but this team is not THAT bad, even with Jordan out for 4 months. New coach, new direction, same players. This is a 84-90 point team, I think its laughable that so many folks think otherwise and have us a total train wreck.
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To play devil's advocate here, the Canes may not be a bad team (lots of parity in the league now) but I think it is a question of who are they clearly better than? There are likely 8-10 teams better than the Canes in the East. That probably puts the Canes in a mystery group with Ottawa, Florida, Buffalo, Toronto and New Jersey that have a ton of question marks for the bottom dwellers in the East.

The Canes are betting the entire season on increased production from both Staals and Semin and the new coach and system. They are also counting on big improvements at goalie by either Cam Ward rediscovering his game or Anton playing the entire year at a high level as the starter....which could be a reach as he has never played more than 36 games in a season.

Let's be honest, the best case scenario with every hope of the Canes coming true puts them fighting for the final playoff spot. The reality is likely lower so it isn't too hard to argue with the pundits that have put the Canes so low....especially now that Jordan is out until mid year.
 
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