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The ****ing Season Thread

The point wasn't that Gardiner is the exact same player as Hedican. The point was Gardiner's floor should be a really effective player based on his one elite skill set. Gardiner possesses the same elite skating that allowed Hedican to be as effective as he was, and with that alone there is no reason why he shouldn't be able to become a similarly good second pair defenseman. Hedican wasn't a good player because he was big and tough. He was Gardiner sized. Its the skating. When you can skate like that it makes up for everything else you can't do.

With the way he skates there is no reason why Gardiner can't be an effective defensive defenseman like Hedican was. And if that is your floor, giving up on him at 24 doesn't make a lot of sense.

And that is completely ignoring the puck skills.
 
Yeah. Hedican was great defensively and strong in general with great hockey IQ. Gardiner is none of those things

Gardiner is an offensive puck moving d ,with more skill on his cock than Hedican ever had. They aren't really comparable at all aside from their skating. I made the comparison too in Gardiner's rookie year. It was wrong wrong wrong. I couldn't have possibly been more wrong unless I pulled a Montana and jerked off to the Lebda signing.

With that said, I would have loved if they were similar. Leafs could use a Hedican clone way more than whatever Gardiner currently is.
 
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Pronger84 said:
What exactly is your point here? Just because Gardiner has an accurate shot doesn't autmotically make him elite, being a good shooter IMO is irrelevant when it comes to being a defensemen, it's all about separating the opponent from the puck and then getting it quickly into the other teams end. Gardiner has the wheels, vision and offensive instincts out there, but where he's lacking is play without the puck such as boxing players out, getting his body properly in the shooting and passing lanes and even at times making the simple outlet pass out of his own end. He's 24 and still young but he still has a lot of learning and growing up out there on the ice.

If we're gonna compare Gardiner to Rielly... sure he may have a better shot out there, but Rielly IMO is the better overall player who thinks the game a lot better then Gardiner does... and keep in mind Rielly is 4 years younger then Gardiner is.
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Who exactly are you arguing with in this post? I assume it's me, because you quoted me, but in the post you quoted, I never said anything about Gardiner being elite. I didn't make any comment about Gardiner's overall skills as a defensemen. I also made no comment whatsoever about who I believe to be the better player between Rielly and Gardiner.

How about instead of assuming what a person's opinions are and then arguing against your own assumptions, you actually respond to what the other person's written? And if you'd like to know what my overall evaluation is of Jake Gardiner as a defenseman, or if you'd like to know how I think Gardiner and Rielly compare, then ask me.
 
At the same point in Hedican's career he was just starting his second full season in the NHL. If anything Gardiner is further along than he was at the same age.

Hedican became Hedican when he figured out how to use his skating to play D.

There is no reason Gardiner can't do the same. Especially just because "he is an offensive defensemen with puck skills." That is completely irrelivant from whether or not he can mature defensively like every other defenseman.
 
James Mirtle ‏
"He outlifts all of us." On Morgan Rielly, his strength, his season and why he's shooting the puck more than ever http://bit.ly/13nUQ6Y

That propensity to shoot has been Rielly’s biggest shift from a year ago. The coaches want him putting more pucks on the net, and he has responded in dramatic fashion, with 2.8 shots a game compared to 1.3 in his rookie year despite similar ice time.

Even more impressively, Rielly leads all NHL defencemen in generating shot attempts, with 21.6 per 60 minutes at even strength, meaning he’s getting a look at the net roughly every 2.5 minutes he’s on the ice.
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So apparently Rielly is playing at 215 pounds this year. Beast.
 
Class of '12 this year (my ranks):

(cf% used is zonestart-adjusted 5v5 close time)

D D.Severson: 10gms, 4gls, 7pts, 59.7cf%, 22:10 (82gms, 33gls, 57pts)
D O.Maatta: 9gms, 1gls, 6pts, 50.9cf%, 20:09 (82gms, 9gls, 55pts)
W T.Pearson: 10gms, 7gls, 9pts, 57.1cf%, 13:19 (82gms, 57gls, 74pts)
W F.Forsberg: 9gms, 1gls, 7pts, 50.6cf%, 16:10 (82gms, 9gls, 64pts)
W A.Galchenyuk: 11gms, 4gls, 8pts, 45.9cf%, 16:18 (82gms, 30gls, 60pts)
D M.Rielly: 9gms, 1gls, 4pts, 56.7cf%, 19:00 (82gms, 9gls, 36pts)
D H.Lindholm: 11gms, 0gls, 2pts, 56.1cf%, 22:08 (82gms, 0gls, 15pts)
D J.Trouba: 10gms, 1gls, 1pts, 50.7cf%, 22:44 (82gms, 8gls, 8pts)
D C.Ceci: 9gms, 0gls, 4pts, 37.3cf%, 19:03 (82gms, 0gls, 36pts)
C Z.Girgensons: 11gms, 2gls, 3pts, 37.2cf%, 17:24 (82gms, 15gls, 23pts)
W T.Hertl: 12gms, 2gls, 3pts, 48.9cf%, 16:10 (82gms, 14gls, 21pts)
W N.Yakupov: 10gms, 2gls, 4pts, 40.7cf%, 13:02 (82gms, 16gls, 33pts)
C C.Tierney: 10gms, 0gls, 2pts, 48.3cf%, 12:21 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)
D M.Dumba: 8gms, 0gls, 1pts, 55.1cf%, 13:20 (82gms, 0gls, 10pts)
D R.Murray: 2gms, 0gls, 0pts, 68.6cf%, 17:46 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
D G.Reinhart: 3gms, 0gls, 0pts, 41.4cf%, 14:23 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
W T.Wilson: 1gms, 0gls, 0pts, 35.7cf%, 8:14 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
 
Great stuff from Damien Cox this morning about the Leafs finally being on the right path. This in particular was really interesting:

We know about the new analytics department. Less discussed has been a decision to expand the team’s development system into something more like baseball where clubs have multiple teams at various competitive levels.

Last year, in addition to the Marlies, the Leafs shared an affiliation with the ECHL Orlando Solar Bears with the Minnesota Wild, and this year the Solar Bears’ sole affiliation is with Toronto. Two weeks ago, the Leafs sent former first-rounder Tyler Biggs to Orlando along with former second-rounder Brad Ross, winger Ryan Rupert, defender Eric Knodel and goalie Garret Sparks.

The idea is that instead of playing a fringe role with the Marlies, Biggs et al will play consistently in prominent situations with the Solar Bears.
The Leafs will send player development coaches frequently to work with those players, and have committed to Orlando that those players will stay for a period of time to compete in a league that is much better and more skill-oriented than it once was.

“We want them to understand it’s not a banishment,” says assistant GM Kyle Dubas.

Biggs, a strapping winger, was a first-rounder the same year as Percy, and his development has been glacially slow. Other Leaf administrations would have bailed on him by now, and maybe he won’t make it at all. But at least the effort is being made to play the long game with this player, and with Leaf players in general. It doesn’t matter if Biggs can play in the NHL now. It’s whether he can in three or four years.
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http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/2014/10/31/maple_leafs_playing_it_smart_with_prospects_cox.html
 
I like the idea. Having a bunch of prospects sitting in the press box or playing extremely marginal roles for the Marlies is the ultimate waste. As an extension of all the extra time, money and effort they're putting into analytics and player development, why not try to turn our ECHL affiliate into a legitimate player development operation?

It's certainly a step up from James Reimer's early days in the Maple Leaf organization after turning pro, when we bounced him between a couple of unaffiliated ECHL teams in Reading, Pennsylvania and South Carolina. Our prospects now will play for a stable Leaf affiliate (located in Orlando, not a bad place to live & work), and they'll still be working with development coaches from the Leaf organization.
 
yeah i expected that from sparks - he's mich better than gibson, and is only down therr because he neess starts. like when we had scrivens down there.
 
I
LeafGm said:
Who exactly are you arguing with in this post? I assume it's me, because you quoted me, but in the post you quoted, I never said anything about Gardiner being elite. I didn't make any comment about Gardiner's overall skills as a defensemen. I also made no comment whatsoever about who I believe to be the better player between Rielly and Gardiner.

How about instead of assuming what a person's opinions are and then arguing against your own assumptions, you actually respond to what the other person's written? And if you'd like to know what my overall evaluation is of Jake Gardiner as a defenseman, or if you'd like to know how I think Gardiner and Rielly compare, then ask me.
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I'm sorry, I replied to the wrong person, my post was directed at leafman101 but instead I quoted you, sorry for offending you there.
 
Dave Bolland update! Only has appeared in 4 games and is on IR with a "lower body injury", also held pointless. Santorelli, Winnik, Komorov >>>>>> Bolland
 
Killer93 said:
5 years @ $5.5 million for Dave friggin Bolland, free agency is just nuts.
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We finally did it right this season. Free agency is when you go out and find the Winnik, Santorelli's, etc to fill in your depth with quality NHL players who other teams can't keep because of cap squeeze, or young players they want to promote, etc.
 
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