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Thread: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

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    Canadiens & 'News & Views' Moderator TheCountofMonteCristo's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    @Monctonscout says Plekanec is a great contributor. I laughed
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    Legend BKerr's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    The point is that the shot.total is high and the guys doing.the shooting have nhl skill.

    Plekanec can still shoot the puck. Gallagher scored all his goals in tight. His hand injury might weaken his wrister but isnt going to effect his greasy goals... they were never about power. Byrons goal chart is similar to gallagher... he might not score 20 again but his shooting percentage isnt going to be 2% either.

    This team would have 11 goals in 4 games if they shot at a percentage that is the worst for a full season in nhl history.

    The goals will come... to be a middle of the pack offensive team and high end defensive team again. Its just a matter of time.

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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by BKerr View Post
    The point is that the shot.total is high and the guys doing.the shooting have nhl skill.

    Plekanec can still shoot the puck. Gallagher scored all his goals in tight. His hand injury might weaken his wrister but isnt going to effect his greasy goals... they were never about power. Byrons goal chart is similar to gallagher... he might not score 20 again but his shooting percentage isnt going to be 2% either.

    This team would have 11 goals in 4 games if they shot at a percentage that is the worst for a full season in nhl history.

    The goals will come... to be a middle of the pack offensive team and high end defensive team again. Its just a matter of time.
    Yep

  4. #124
    Legend lecoqsportif's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Plekanec sux.
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    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Plekanec is fine as a $3m third line center. A $6m second line center? Not so much.
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    Legend Altair's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Plekanec is fine as a $3m third line center. A $6m second line center? Not so much.
    We need that salary to help keep us over the cap floor.

    Serious, 8.5 million in cap space, nobody needs to care about players cap hit right now
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    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    It's not about that. It's about logic.
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    Legend Altair's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    It's not about that. It's about logic.
    He salary means nothing. His cap hit means nothing. Does he deserve it? No. Is it effecting the team any? Also no.
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    Legend Sal_Butera's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Altair View Post
    We need that salary to help keep us over the cap floor.

    Serious, 8.5 million in cap space, nobody needs to care about players cap hit right now
    Isn’t it now over $9M with Streit potential buyout?


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  10. #130
    Legend BKerr's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Sal_Butera View Post
    Isn’t it now over $9M with Streit potential buyout?
    Less.

    It went down because Schlemko was on IR and so we kept Morrow on the team. He was assumed to be in the minors with that 8.5 million.

    We are at $7.6 before the buyout, so $8.3 after.

  11. #131
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Been hearing for about 4 years now that the Habs are just unlucky with their shooting, always facing great goalies in the playoffs (who, curiously enough, other teams are able to score on), yada, yada, yada. Sorry, not buying it. The Habs lack offensive skill. End of story.

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    ADMINuteman Habspatrol's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Krustchev View Post
    Been hearing for about 4 years now that the Habs are just unlucky with their shooting, always facing great goalies in the playoffs (who, curiously enough, other teams are able to score on), yada, yada, yada. Sorry, not buying it. The Habs lack offensive skill. End of story.
    Have you? I don't recall that. I don't think anyone is claiming that the Habs are just unlucky year after year. They've been a middle of the pack offensive team in recent years and so far this year they've played like an average or better team offensively. Their shooting percentage will correct itself... it just will. It's impossible for it not to.
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    Canadiens Moderator DonKay's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by BKerr View Post
    The point is that the shot.total is high and the guys doing.the shooting have nhl skill.

    Plekanec can still shoot the puck. Gallagher scored all his goals in tight. His hand injury might weaken his wrister but isnt going to effect his greasy goals... they were never about power. Byrons goal chart is similar to gallagher... he might not score 20 again but his shooting percentage isnt going to be 2% either.

    This team would have 11 goals in 4 games if they shot at a percentage that is the worst for a full season in nhl history.

    The goals will come... to be a middle of the pack offensive team and high end defensive team again. Its just a matter of time.
    You can't just make a blanket statement and say that just because the guys have "NHL skill" that we will be fine offensively.

    Not all NHL players have the abilities to put pucks in the net....I remember Oleg Petrov who had tons of scoring chances on a nightly basis but couldn't finish very well, what Jan Bulis? these are just examples that scoring chances and shots are one thing but being able to put the damn puck in the net is a whole other aspect

    I agree with you in that the offense will pick up, but to what extent is the question?

    I still maintain we will be a bottom ten team in the NHL offensively. And our struggles will continue unless the talent improves.

    Our struggles will be even more amplifies in the playoffs when scoring becomes that much harder.
    Go Habs Go!

  14. #134
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Habspatrol View Post
    Have you? I don't recall that. I don't think anyone is claiming that the Habs are just unlucky year after year. They've been a middle of the pack offensive team in recent years and so far this year they've played like an average or better team offensively. Their shooting percentage will correct itself... it just will. It's impossible for it not to.
    Shooting percentage will improve for sure but to what extent?

    And I can't understand how we can say we've been an average team or better offensively this year if we have 4 goals in 4 games.

    Problem is that some of you are continuously saying that the shooting percentage will improve, which it will, it's common sense.

    But the issue lies to what kind of number it will improve to?

    This team spent a better part of the second half last year and the playoffs having a hard time scoring goals...why?
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    ADMINuteman Habspatrol's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    The theory is that offense isn't just goals. It's opportunities. Good offensive teams get more opportunities. In a small sample size it may or may not result in a lot of goals. Like 1, 2 or 5 games the goal totals won't necessarily reflect a team's offensive play. Over the course of 10, 20, 40 or 82 games the goal totals will continuously work towards lining up with opportunity totals.
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    Canadiens Moderator DonKay's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by Habspatrol View Post
    The theory is that offense isn't just goals. It's opportunities. Good offensive teams get more opportunities. In a small sample size it may or may not result in a lot of goals. Like 1, 2 or 5 games the goal totals won't necessarily reflect a team's offensive play. Over the course of 10, 20, 40 or 82 games the goal totals will continuously work towards lining up with opportunity totals.
    It make sense in theory of course...it's logical, generate opportunities to increase you opportunity to score.

    However there is a skill set required to be able to cash in on those opportunities...a skill set that we are lacking and that will prevent us from cashing in more often
    Go Habs Go!

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    Legend BKerr's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Unless you are a john scott or some other talentless plug... top 9 nhl forwards are going to score between 8-12% of their shots.

    A guy like ovechkin or laine or stamkos might go a little above that... but those guys are rare. Even then ovys numbers arent that much higher. His quantity of goals is due to the fact he almost always leads the league in shots.

    Guess who almost always leads our team in shots? Max. The same guy who leads in goals.

    premium Goal scorers in the nhl are only marginally better shooters than other players. the main reason they put up more goals isnt because their shots are that much better its because they find ways to take more shots. volume is key here.

    If we keep getting this level of possession we wont be bottom 10 in the nhl in goals scored over 82 games. We will be at worst in the middle of the pack.

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    ADMINuteman Habspatrol's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by DonKay View Post
    It make sense in theory of course...it's logical, generate opportunities to increase you opportunity to score.

    However there is a skill set required to be able to cash in on those opportunities...a skill set that we are lacking and that will prevent us from cashing in more often
    Except Montreal has been firmly in the middle of the pack at about 9+% for the past 5 years. There's no real reason to expect much of a difference this season.

    As BKerr has pointed out. Even if we all of a sudden tie with last year's Avs as the worst shooting team of all time... and keep getting the shot volume we have, we would score 11 goals every 4 games instead of 4. That's 2.75 goals per game. We scored 2.72 goals per game last season.

    I wouldn't call the first 4 games "bad luck." I would just call it a small sample size that will progress to the mean.
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  19. #139
    Canadiens Moderator DonKay's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    I'll ask a very simple questions because I see your points and they make sense.

    However I cannot dismiss as easily as you guys are the aspect of scoring abilities.

    Do you believe that there are NHL players that are just not good at scoring goals?

    If so, do you believe we have enough players that are good at scoring goals?
    Go Habs Go!

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    ADMINuteman Habspatrol's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Good The Bad & The Ugly: Game #4: Blackhawks @ Canadiens

    Quote Originally Posted by DonKay View Post
    I'll ask a very simple questions because I see your points and they make sense.

    However I cannot dismiss as easily as you guys are the aspect of scoring abilities.

    Do you believe that there are NHL players that are just not good at scoring goals?

    If so, do you believe we have enough players that are good at scoring goals?
    Of course. That really doesn't even need a response.

    We basically have the same team that finished 15th in goals last season. So...

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