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Thread: OT: American Politics

  1. #106461
    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    For decades, the county has regularly been a hot zone for election night chaos in both statewide and national races, including the infamous 2000 presidential election. Years of problems have only slapped additional coats of paint on the countyís sordid reputation as a black hole for ballots. Broward County Elections Supervisor Brenda Snipes, the target of Scottís legal action, has been accused in recent years of illegally destroying ballots and mismanagement.

    ďThe #Broward Elections Supervisor has been pulling stunts like this for years and weíre not going to let her get away with it,Ē GOP Chairwoman Ronna McDaniel tweeted Thursday. ď#Broward election supervisors ongoing violation of #Florida law requiring timely reporting isnít just annoying incompetence,Ē Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) said on Twitter. ďIt has opened the door for lawyers to come here & try to steal a seat in the U.S. Senate & Florida Cabinet.Ē
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...=.2799c595f392


    As I said, the trust is gone.

    If these votes are legit and the courts slam it down you can thank Brenda Snipes.
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  2. #106462
    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    it's really not that hard to find non-partisan election officials. at least it shouldn't be. christ.

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    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayward DP View Post
    what are the irregularities in Broward currently?
    Read the article I posted. The problem is these votes werenít identified within the allowable reporting period. They were ďfound new votesĒ.

    Canít do that. If they donít get counted, itís on her and her department. Those that donít like it should change the laws. Laws matter, even if they seem unfair.
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Incompetence shouldn't be rewarded? If votes weren't counted because of the incompetence of election officials then they should not be counted because not rewarding incompetence is more important than counting votes of Americans?

  5. #106465
    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayward DP View Post
    it's really not that hard to find non-partisan election officials. at least it shouldn't be. christ.
    Iíve lived in Florida for over 30 years now. Broward and Palm Beach has had ridiculous problems with elections and itís tiresome. For all I know my vote didnít count.
    #FireJulien#FireMarcBergevin Burn Geoff Molson in effigy! #worstmanagementstaffever

  6. #106466
    Legend zeke's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Finding votes.

    Next you’ll tell me the Democrats never manufactured votes in the past. That they are white hat politicians that would never cheat.

    The real issue zeke is that Broward and Palm Beach once again broke Florida election laws on reporting. Once again votes are “found” that they didn’t know about. Unless you’re completely in the tank (which you are) you have to admit it can look fishy.

    If the courts decide the votes are legit and should be counted I’m completely fine with it. If they decide the laws were broken sufficiently to deny the addition, I’m good with it because I’m sick and tired of people picking and choosing what laws are “right or wrong” and which to follow.

    Rick Scott has a good point, how is it counties that got slammed with a hurricane can comply but Broward and Palm Beach can’t? Why do they get to play by different rules?

    Is it incompetence? I’d say highly likely. Incompetence shouldn’t be rewarded.
    except in 2000, when they magically found more Bush votes, after Gore was declared winner. you forgot that little one.



    and Scott made all sorts of special rules to help those hurricane districts vote. well, at least the red ones.

    and why are we talking about Scott presiding over his own election, anyways? how is that not blatant corruption right off the bat?
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    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by leafman101 View Post
    Incompetence shouldn't be rewarded? If votes weren't counted because of the incompetence of election officials then they should not be counted because not rewarding incompetence is more important than counting votes of Americans?
    Laws shouldnít be ignored because of repeated incompetence.

    You can spin this any way you like.

    Secondly, we do not know exactly whatís going on. Now the lawyers have descended so buckle up.

    Lastly, I mean what I say. Iím good either way. Votes should be counted but laws matter. Iím just glad Iím not the one making this decision.
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by zeke View Post
    except in 2000, when they magically found more Bush votes, after Gore was declared winner.
    Touchť.
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    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Letís be clear here, the issue is the identification of votes. Counties report that they have X amount of votes then get time to count them. Coming back after the reporting period saying we have found new votes is against the reporting laws.
    #FireJulien#FireMarcBergevin Burn Geoff Molson in effigy! #worstmanagementstaffever

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    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Read the article I posted. The problem is these votes weren’t identified within the allowable reporting period. They were “found new votes”.

    Can’t do that. If they don’t get counted, it’s on her and her department. Those that don’t like it should change the laws. Laws matter, even if they seem unfair.
    so I read the article. nowhere does it say the votes were not identified within the allowable reporting period. it says:

    As The Washington Post reported Thursday, Florida election officials have until Saturday to tally votes to determine whether both the Senate and gubernatorial races will head to a recount. But Snipes on Thursday fueled the latest Broward controversy — and conspiracy theories — when she failed to explain how long her office’s count would take.
    unless you were referring to previous elections. but they're still within the allowable period for this one. if new votes materialize after the weekend, that's a different story.

    I mean, ignoring past history (which, fair enough, raises some serious questions), it sounds like they are literally just counting all the votes currently.

    and I made my previous post before reading the article - this Snipes woman was appointed by J Bush, which I'm guessing means she isn't a Dem partisan, and just incompetent. of course, with the state overseeing the election, who knows how much of the problems in Broward are a result of Snipes and her team vs the state (i.e. deliberate underfunding, understaffing to prevent them from having the resources required to do the job right)

  11. #106471
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Laws shouldn’t be ignored because of repeated incompetence.

    You can spin this any way you like.

    Secondly, we do not know exactly what’s going on. Now the lawyers have descended so buckle up.

    Lastly, I mean what I say. I’m good either way. Votes should be counted but laws matter. I’m just glad I’m not the one making this decision.
    What law though?

    The lawsuit is about production of records, not votes not counting.

  12. #106472
    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Let’s be clear here, the issue is the identification of votes. Counties report that they have X amount of votes then get time to count them. Coming back after the reporting period saying we have found new votes is against the reporting laws.
    as far as I can tell, from the article you posted, this has not happened yet.

  13. #106473
    Wrong Thinker Extraordinaire Habsy's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Read my post above yours. Thatís the challenge.
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  14. #106474
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayward DP View Post
    as far as I can tell, from the article you posted, this has not happened yet.
    Not what Iím hearing down here.

    I work in Broward, these votes werenít identified in the allowable time period. Thatís what Iím hearing. Donít shoot the messenger.
    #FireJulien#FireMarcBergevin Burn Geoff Molson in effigy! #worstmanagementstaffever

  15. #106475
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by leafman101 View Post
    What law though?

    The lawsuit is about production of records, not votes not counting.
    The production of records lawsuit is for the new votes. They want to see if they were reported within the allowable reporting period.

    Florida law basically says a County has to report total votes. If Broward reported a million, then the reporting period expires, then they say thereís 1.1 million total, that breaks the law. Theyíre suing for records to see if they were reported on time.

    As I said, their incompetence gave the gop a challenge.
    #FireJulien#FireMarcBergevin Burn Geoff Molson in effigy! #worstmanagementstaffever

  16. #106476
    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Habsy View Post
    Not what I’m hearing down here.

    I work in Broward, these votes weren’t identified in the allowable time period. That’s what I’m hearing. Don’t shoot the messenger.
    you may not know the answers to these questions, but I think we need more information to be certain that what is being alleged has occurred - do you know where I can find the law you're referencing (re identifying voters)? and do you know if/how to confirm whether and when a county has reported the IDs?

    also, do you have problems with people like Scott and Kemp overseeing elections in which they are candidates? this is a side issue to who actually one, but relevant to voter suppression. I'm not going to pretend I know what happened in Florida, but I would be surprised if Scott didn't try to use the levers available to him to make his path to victory easier.

  17. #106477
    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    I think I found Florida's election law - https://dos.myflorida.com/media/6997...-code-2017.pdf

  18. #106478
    Legend zeke's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayward DP View Post

    also, do you have problems with people like Scott and Kemp overseeing elections in which they are candidates? this is a side issue to who actually one, but relevant to voter suppression. I'm not going to pretend I know what happened in Florida, but I would be surprised if Scott didn't try to use the levers available to him to make his path to victory easier.
    I mean, it's kinda crazy to even ask that question or to call it a side issue.
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  19. #106479
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    I think the most encouraging thing from all the exit poll data I saw was that everyone was happy about the economy and still there was a blue wave.

    that was my biggest worry all along - that the GOP would ride in after all of Obama's tough work on the economy (which the top tried to sabotage at every turn) and take all the glory for it's inevitable success.

    the fact that people are wise to that makes me very hopeful.
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  20. #106480
    Hall of Famer Wayward DP's Avatar
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    Default Re: OT: American Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by zeke View Post
    I mean, it's kinda crazy to even ask that question or to call it a side issue.
    side issue as in peripheral to an actual recount and the actual results.

    it is a big issue on its own merits, but side issue to what we were discussing. and I should be clear in stating that I am unequivocally opposed to a candidate being allowed to oversee the election in which they are running. that's banana republic shit. but I wanted to give Habsy a chance to share this thoughts on it without poisoning the well so to speak

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