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Game 13 - Tampa Bay Lightning @ Montreal Canadiens - SAT NOV 3RD 7:00 EST

xposbrad said:
I completely disagree. Habs fans crave any bit of excitement they can get because there is basically no competition in town. Many are delusional and get hard ons if we have a winning streak not realizing the real state of the franchise. They are not getting tired anytime soon. We could miss the playoffs 2 years in a row, and then have a somewhat competitive team that will fall flat on its feet and habs fans will just say we have next year to make improvements. I'm calling what will happen. We will be mediocre this year, we might make a push for the playoffs when Weber gets back. It will result in a mid round pick that will end up not making the NHL or be a 4th liner and we will be stuck in mediocrity until MB leaves. We won't do a proper rebuild, I just get that feeling.
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Nope, not anymore.

Disposal income is not what it once was, and that factors into what millennial's will spend their money on. I speak on behalf of that generation when it comes to money. We won't spend unless there is a return.

Someone making $115,000 a year is not the same as it was 20 years ago. This is a big factor.

And FYI -- it's almost like you're ignoring what's going on. The team is not rebuilding, and attendance has started to dip for the first time in years. That is proof that we are sick of this "murky middle" crap. A certain demographic (and now the most important demographic) simply won't waste money on a crap product when they need to spend $2000.00 to $3000.00 a month for rent.
 
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Altair said:
You know you're entitled as a fan when attendance dips by 500-1000 a night and but you're SECOND in the league in attendance and you're complaining.

Look at Ottawa, that's fans not showing up.
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Ottawa isn't a real market, everyone knows that to be the case.

We jettisoned just about everyone we could legitimately jettison, are playing our 3rd overall, are clearly "rebuilding" yet despite what I read here, the fans are not selling it out. Not my fault I was correct. If the attendance stayed at the average it is now, at $150.00 per ticket, over 41 games, that is 3.7 million of lost revenue. Hardly chump change. That doesn't factor in the drop in food and drink sales from those non attending fans.

Our TV ratings are also down.

If we continue winning as we have been, I suspect we will sell out more than 3 of every 8 home games.
 
CaptainBolduke said:
Nope, not anymore.

Disposal income is not what it once was, and that factors into what millennial's will spend their money on. I speak on behalf of that generation when it comes to money. We won't spend unless there is a return.

Someone making $115,000 a year is not the same as it was 20 years ago. This is a big factor.

And FYI -- it's almost like you're ignoring what's going on. The team is not rebuilding, and attendance has started to dip for the first time in years. That is proof that we are of this "murky middle" crap. A certain demographic (and now the most important demographic) simply won't waste money on a crap product when they need to spend $2000.00 to $3000.00 a month for rent.
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This is true, and it's also why people won't pay good money to see a tanking team. They will wait until the team is competitive again to return.
 
It could very well be, but we don't know -- cause we haven't tried.

We are starting to see actual proof that we won't spend money on a "go no where" product that is stuck in neutral.
 
CaptainBolduke said:
Nope, not anymore.

Disposal income is not what it once was, and that factors into what millennial's will spend their money on. I speak on behalf of that generation when it comes to money. We won't spend unless there is a return.

Someone making $115,000 a year is not the same as it was 20 years ago. This is a big factor.

And FYI -- it's almost like you're ignoring what's going on. The team is not rebuilding, and attendance has started to dip for the first time in years. That is proof that we are sick of this "murky middle" crap. A certain demographic (and now the most important demographic) simply won't waste money on a crap product when they need to spend $2000.00 to $3000.00 a month for rent.
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You say we're not rebuilding, Count seems to think we are. I think we're doing a retool on the fly, but we're done because we'll end up with a mid round pick this year. Instead of a much needed top 5.
 
xposbrad said:
You say we're not rebuilding, Count seems to think we are. I think we're doing a retool on the fly, but we're done because we'll end up with a mid round pick this year. Instead of a much needed top 5.
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The retool on the fly should of started years ago and timed properly instead of changing direction after every year .

A well run team might of turned the corner with real players to move forward with proper drafting and asset management

It cost us multiple picks and assets hanging on to vets Markov, Komi, Pleks and many others .
 
GEEMAN said:
The retool on the fly should of started years ago and timed properly instead of changing direction after every year .

A well run team might of turned the corner with real players to move forward with proper drafting and asset management

It cost us multiple picks and assets hanging on to vets Markov, Komi, Pleks and many others .
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come on, you can't bring up Komisarek as evidence, that is from years ago. Why not mention Souray too?

No team jettisons players when they think they can win in a given year, that is stupidity.

In any event, we have now jettisoned basically everyone they can (I would like Shaw and Alzner to go too but that is unlikely given their contracts).

Our new "core" is now quite young, Mole, Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. That is a completely different core from two years ago. The team is nowhere near the same as two years ago.
 
GEEMAN said:
The retool on the fly should of started years ago and timed properly instead of changing direction after every year .

A well run team might of turned the corner with real players to move forward with proper drafting and asset management

It cost us multiple picks and assets hanging on to vets Markov, Komi, Pleks and many others .
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come on, you can't bring up Komisarek as evidence, that is from years ago. Why not mention Souray too?

No team jettisons players when they think they can win in a given year, that is stupidity.

In any event, we have now jettisoned basically everyone they can (I would like Shaw and Alzner to go too but that is unlikely given their contracts).

Our new "core" is now quite young, Mole, Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. That is a completely different core from two years ago. The team is nowhere near the same as two years ago.
 
GrandWazoo said:
This is true, and it's also why people won't pay good money to see a tanking team. They will wait until the team is competitive again to return.
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The paying public and corporate suits have paid good money for a decade to watch this team . How do you expect to be legit competitive again if you keep doing the same bandaid job and never start a rebuild/retool. After a decade of crap thats why the fans are not showing up or spending money on the product .

GW it never had to be this way if the ship was run properly. So its the chicken and the egg syndrome year in year out .

We cant compete but we arent willing to start to get better . Fans dont care and show up less cause the product stinks .

So how do we become competitive until you first put the right pieces ( chicken ) in place.
 
xposbrad said:
You say we're not rebuilding, Count seems to think we are. I think we're doing a retool on the fly, but we're done because we'll end up with a mid round pick this year. Instead of a much needed top 5.
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Teams that employ the likes of Carey Price and Shea Weber are not rebuilding. This is not a real rebuild. Full stop.

With that said, I still think this team is drafting Top 7 this year. We are only 1 or 2 loses away from being bottom 10.
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
come on, you can't bring up Komisarek as evidence, that is from years ago. Why not mention Souray too?

No team jettisons players when they think they can win in a given year, that is stupidity.

In any event, we have now jettisoned basically everyone they can (I would like Shaw and Alzner to go too but that is unlikely given their contracts).

Our new "core" is now quite young, Mole, Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. That is a completely different core from two years ago. The team is nowhere near the same as two years ago.
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Come on Count , you know what happened .

Gainey let a near entire roster hit UFA a decade ago. Most of those players werent coming back guaranteed .

Then we were forced to sign a bunch of midgets and scrubs just to fill a roster in free agency.

We didnt capitalize on any of those expiring contracts .

Pleks and Markov cost us easily 2 first rounders plus other young assets .

Then you add the wrong trade for PK and Drubust , the free agency mistakes , and you have the mess your in right now

Ignore the mole for now at 18 , is this the core for a contender Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. , cmon Count .

These are your secondary pieces not your glue guys . These are your Hornquists , Guenztals , and Saad`s .

Your missing the Sid , Malkin and Kanes to compete .

My point is if they didnt make these bonehead mistakes we would of had a near decade of putting together a proper constructed team .
 
GEEMAN said:
Come on Count , you know what happened .

Gainey let a near entire roster hit UFA a decade ago. Most of those players werent coming back guaranteed .

Then we were forced to sign a bunch of midgets and scrubs just to fill a roster in free agency.

We didnt capitalize on any of those expiring contracts .

Pleks and Markov cost us easily 2 first rounders plus other young assets .

Then you add the wrong trade for PK and Drubust , the free agency mistakes , and you have the mess your in right now

Ignore the mole for now at 18 , is this the core for a contender Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. , cmon Count .

These are your secondary pieces not your glue guys . These are your Hornquists , Guenztals , and Saad`s .

Your missing the Sid , Malkin and Kanes to compete .

My point is if they didnt make these bonehead mistakes we would of had a near decade of putting together a proper constructed team .
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We were in the playoffs in 2009, he could not jettison the entire lineup of UFAs like Kovalev, Koivu at the trade deadline. It didn't work out but when was the last time a GM in the NHL was in a playoff spot in March, sold off the team?

We also replaced those UFAs on July 1 and went to SF the next season.

If you think Markov would have gotten us a 1st round choice in 2017, feel free but there is no way he gets that, hell most here said he was crap and couldn't skate. If posters on a webboard could see it, why coulnd't scouts and other GMs?

Plekanec getting a 1st round choice, sure if you live in some evil parallel universe.

Intersting when ripping on the new core (you wanted rid of the old one, have a new one and still complain), you didn't include the Mole.

Given there are only three Crosbys, Malkins and Kanes, hard to complain they aren't on our team. We lost out on PN by one number and never had a shot at 97. The chances of us getting the next one in Lafreniere is quite small.

We do have too many 1st rd busts, but Timmins never gets fired and his sycophants in the media and on social media will fight to the death showing how great he is. I don't agree but theer is shit all we can do if his choices end up busting out, right now we have no 1st rd choice from 2008-2014 in the lineup. That is on him.
 
GEEMAN said:
Come on Count , you know what happened .

Gainey let a near entire roster hit UFA a decade ago. Most of those players werent coming back guaranteed .

Then we were forced to sign a bunch of midgets and scrubs just to fill a roster in free agency.

We didnt capitalize on any of those expiring contracts .

Pleks and Markov cost us easily 2 first rounders plus other young assets .

Then you add the wrong trade for PK and Drubust , the free agency mistakes , and you have the mess your in right now

Ignore the mole for now at 18 , is this the core for a contender Gallagher, Lehkonen, Domi, Danault, Drouin. , cmon Count .

These are your secondary pieces not your glue guys . These are your Hornquists , Guenztals , and Saad`s .

Your missing the Sid , Malkin and Kanes to compete .

My point is if they didnt make these bonehead mistakes we would of had a near decade of putting together a proper constructed team .
Click to expand...

We were in the playoffs in 2009, he could not jettison the entire lineup of UFAs like Kovalev, Koivu at the trade deadline. It didn't work out but when was the last time a GM in the NHL was in a playoff spot in March, sold off the team?

We also replaced those UFAs on July 1 and went to SF the next season.

If you think Markov would have gotten us a 1st round choice in 2017, feel free but there is no way he gets that, hell most here said he was crap and couldn't skate. If posters on a webboard could see it, why coulnd't scouts and other GMs?

Plekanec getting a 1st round choice, sure if you live in some evil parallel universe.

Intersting when ripping on the new core (you wanted rid of the old one, have a new one and still complain), you didn't include the Mole.

Given there are only three Crosbys, Malkins and Kanes, hard to complain they aren't on our team. We lost out on PN by one number and never had a shot at 97. The chances of us getting the next one in Lafreniere is quite small.

We do have too many 1st rd busts, but Timmins never gets fired and his sycophants in the media and on social media will fight to the death showing how great he is. I don't agree but there is shit all we can do if his choices end up busting out, right now we have no 1st rd choice from 2008-2014 in the lineup. That is on him.
 
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GEEMAN said:
The paying public and corporate suits have paid good money for a decade to watch this team . How do you expect to be legit competitive again if you keep doing the same bandaid job and never start a rebuild/retool. After a decade of crap thats why the fans are not showing up or spending money on the product .

GW it never had to be this way if the ship was run properly. So its the chicken and the egg syndrome year in year out .

We cant compete but we arent willing to start to get better . Fans dont care and show up less cause the product stinks .

So how do we become competitive until you first put the right pieces ( chicken ) in place.
Click to expand...

I'm in favor of a rebuild, even though I actually like what has been done this year, but being in favor of a rebuild doesn't mean I would pay to see the product while in rebuild mode. I'll pay to see a competitive game with chances to win. If they are gunning for last place, I'll wait until next year to go watch them. If the Habs are interested on the bottom line every year, then they will trying to be competitive. Tanking will hurt their bottom line that year, guaranteed.
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
We were in the playoffs in 2009, he could not jettison the entire lineup of UFAs like Kovalev, Koivu at the trade deadline. It didn't work out but when was the last time a GM in the NHL was in a playoff spot in March, sold off the team?

We also replaced those UFAs on July 1 and went to SF the next season.

If you think Markov would have gotten us a 1st round choice in 2017, feel free but there is no way he gets that, hell most here said he was crap and couldn't skate. If posters on a webboard could see it, why coulnd't scouts and other GMs?

Plekanec getting a 1st round choice, sure if you live in some evil parallel universe.

Intersting when ripping on the new core (you wanted rid of the old one, have a new one and still complain), you didn't include the Mole.

Given there are only three Crosbys, Malkins and Kanes, hard to complain they aren't on our team. We lost out on PN by one number and never had a shot at 97. The chances of us getting the next one in Lafreniere is quite small.

We do have too many 1st rd busts, but Timmins never gets fired and his sycophants in the media and on social media will fight to the death showing how great he is. I don't agree but theer is shit all we can do if his choices end up busting out, right now we have no 1st rd choice from 2008-2014 in the lineup. That is on him.
Click to expand...

The team was in a tail spin, we had just fired the coach, we were going nowhere it was evident. With that many upcoming UFAs on the team Gainey should have done the right thing for the future of the franchise. This was his biggest mistake during his tenure, up there with the Gomez trade, which not coincidentally happened the same year.
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
Ottawa isn't a real market, everyone knows that to be the case.

We jettisoned just about everyone we could legitimately jettison, are playing our 3rd overall, are clearly "rebuilding" yet despite what I read here, the fans are not selling it out. Not my fault I was correct. If the attendance stayed at the average it is now, at $150.00 per ticket, over 41 games, that is 3.7 million of lost revenue. Hardly chump change. That doesn't factor in the drop in food and drink sales from those non attending fans.

Our TV ratings are also down.

If we continue winning as we have been, I suspect we will sell out more than 3 of every 8 home games.
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Second in the entire NHL.

Give me a break.
 
GrandWazoo said:
The team was in a tail spin, we had just fired the coach, we were going nowhere it was evident. With that many upcoming UFAs on the team Gainey should have done the right thing for the future of the franchise. This was his biggest mistake during his tenure, up there with the Gomez trade, which not coincidentally happened the same year.
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No way ownership / Gillett with his debt issues (Habs + Liverpool) would’ve allowed that to happen during the Centennial season. Had to try to get any playoff revenue at all cost

McGuire said during his interview he told Jr & Savard Habs need to complete a short rebuild process to add to the core depth and was told that strategy was a non-starter.
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
That might be but no way Gainey was writing off the season when we were in a playoff spot.
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But he should have had, which was the point. Instead he went into buyer's mode and spend another 2nd round pick to get Schneider (if I recall correctly).

You really where you are to you recoup your losses. We had Kovalev, Koivu, Komisarek and Tanguay all expiring. You don't spend your 2nd on Schneider and you trade the other guys and you can probably get 2-3 firsts and a few more 2nds. And you can still go shopping for UFAs in the summer, and now you also have picks to trade. Maybe we trade a 1st for Gomez instead of McDonagh.
 
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