Around the League 2017-2018 Edition
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worm
Well-known member
Altair
Well-known member
Yay advanced stats!
UWHabs
Well-known member
They don't match perfectly. The Jays would be like the Habs if they traded Stroman for Verlander to get a "more veteran" guy, and then signed Donaldson to an 8-year extension. Not chatter for this thread, but the Jays management I don't believe has failed so badly in their moves that they are jeopardizing the long-term of the organization, whereas the Habs have very certainly gone down that path.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
Yeah, but Price can't carry this version of the team all by himself. There's no depth.
He'll steal some games, as he did in that 5 game streak, but their core is rotten and Price really isn't the .930 - .935 goalie that people make him out to be. He had one incredible .933 season, but in all his other seasons, he's topped .920 only three times. He has legend status, but especially considering his playoff track record, maybe somewhat undeserved.
I admit, when he sizzles for a few games, it makes me doubt myself a bit, but overall, this is a shit team that's going nowhere, with or without him.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
I honestly have never been uninterested in watching Leafs games, no matter how bad they've been. If they're good, I'm excited to see them win. If they're bad, I like to watch whatever younger players we've got and hope for a high pick. I never lose interest.
But the Jays and Raps, I definitely do swing back and forth. I still follow the Jays quite a bit, but no time or really desire to watch the games this past season, and the Raps I am totally bored with until playoff time when I'll be more interested but still not care much because I know the handful of stacked teams will win in the end.
So, your reaction to your Habs is very similar to mine to the other Toronto teams. But I can never not be keen on the Leafs.
UWHabs
Well-known member
I used to be that way. I paid for RDS in the past, I'd catch games when I could. But yeah, I've basically completely stopped caring about the team until we get new management who will make me care. Hopefully Jays management won't make me feel the same way about them (although at least the crappiness last year means I got some nice dirt cheap tickets to games in August/September).
LeafGm
Well-known member
Yeah, I hear you. I mean, it's pretty much impossible to get me to stop watching the Leafs, but the franchise finally made that happen in the latter half of the 2013/14 season.
At that point, they were fresh off the game 7 collapse against Boston the previous season, and the infamous "18-wheeler off a cliff" the season before that. Randy Carlyle was our "mind-boggled" head coach, Dave Nonis was in total control of our hockey operations, and David Clarkson & Dave Bolland were Nonis's prized off-season acquisitions.
So, once that team started falling to pieces once again in the second half of that season, I stopped watching the team altogether, except for checking the score of their games at the end of the night (hoping for losses), and taking part in discussions around here. I didn't even watch many games to start the next season after the hiring of Brendan Shanahan in the off-season, because he had elected to bring back Nonis, give Randy Carlyle an extension and make no substantive changes to the roster, so I wasn't convinced that Shanahan wasn't just more of the same.
It wasn't until word started leaking out that Shanahan was planning a full, tear-it-down rebuild, and after they fired Carlyle mid-season and stated their commitment to having interim coach Peter Horachek force the group they had to play strong possession hockey that I came back and started watching every game.
The bottom line as a fan is that you need at least some semblance of hope that at some point, thinks could possibly get better.
And that would be the biggest similarity between the Habs & Jays at the moment. I don't really see how anyone could look at how either team is constructed, and look at the people that are running the show, and have any sane expectation that things are going to get better anytime soon.
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Wayward DP
Well-known member
I have always been like you for both the Leafs and the Jays. Then, 2016/17 offseason, something changed. And now I am not like that anymore.
For the Leafs, I've lost interest as some of our more atrocious seasons went on, but I don't think I have ever entirely stopped watching for any stretch of any significant duration.
MindzEye
Wayward Ditch Pig
I guess we have to define what he's carrying them towards. Carrying him towards a bubble finish and a 1st or 2nd round exit? I don't see that being out of the question at all. To the top of the conference and a deep playoff run with that group, yeah, that's not happening.
5 times, and in 3 of his last 4 seasons (with the 4th being an injury shortened season where he was north of .930 when he got injured)
I don't think anyone considers him a legend. Elite though? Absolutely. Only goalie in the world with as good a track record over the last few years is Bobrovsky, and maybe Holtby
BeLeafer
Well-known member
Welcome to my Leafsfan life circa 2004-15.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
I think "the best goalie in the world" tagline precedes or follows his name every time it's uttered. The legend is pretty strong, if you ask me. If any casual observer had to make a judgment based on just the hype thrown at Price, they'd believe he's head and shoulders above everyone and the next guy is a distant second. And that's really just not the case.
Can he carry them into the first round? Sure, that's possible. But I'm still betting no on that one this season. I think as the competition gets stiffer the deeper the season goes, they'll fold.
Regarding his stats, I didn't count the 12 game season, nor his first season where he was .920 on the nose in 40 games as a rookie. I said topped .920, which he's done only four times overall in legit seasons of play. It's really not that amazing. He was incredible in that .933 year, and suddenly he was anointed. Since then, he's been good, but certainly not the best, and very beatable in the playoffs.
But to be clear, he is elite. Just not the runaway best goalie in the world like he's constantly advertised to be.
MindzEye
Wayward Ditch Pig
Dirty mother****er
CH1
The Artist Formerly Known as chiggins.
I'm barely watching the Habs this year -- and it's not because they're flirting with the cellar. I have no problem rooting for a team that's struggling but headed in the right direction with some promising kids. But the franchise is headed the wrong way and lacks any sort of pipeline.
Carey Price playing the angles correctly can only provide so much entertainment. Lots of better tv for me to watch.
Carey Price playing the angles correctly can only provide so much entertainment. Lots of better tv for me to watch.
LeafGm
Well-known member
Yeah, I'd say that's a good call. The Melnyk nonsense really seems to be hitting critical mass this year.
Case in point, this quote from Kyle Turris today:
Josh Clipperton @JClipperton_CP
Kyle Turris speaking in Vancouver on the end of his time in Ottawa: “It’s tough because I think management did want to sign me, but I think that the owner didn’t. And that was his decision.” #Predators #Senators
Volcanologist
Well-known member
which pretty much spells doom for them paying market value for Karlsson. Ottawa can't afford an 8 figure player, plain and simple.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
Karlsson is pretty obviously leaving, imho.
So who can accommodate him? He's not going to go to any non-contender or a team that doesn't spend to the max, so who does that leave?
Leafs have to be a viable option. But I believe the Sens will trade him first to some other team, and that team will have the best shot of signing him before he even hits UFA.
So who can accommodate him? He's not going to go to any non-contender or a team that doesn't spend to the max, so who does that leave?
Leafs have to be a viable option. But I believe the Sens will trade him first to some other team, and that team will have the best shot of signing him before he even hits UFA.
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