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BeLeafer
10-22-2014, 12:41 AM
https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F2.bp.blogspot.com%2F-1dUyC88_JFM%2FTdo6u4PSo5I%2FAAAAAAAAAcU%2FRtir2Pf4 Kfk%2Fs1600%2FBigDogLittleDog.jpg&f=1

zeke
10-22-2014, 12:45 AM
:thumbup:

corksens
10-22-2014, 08:03 AM
Any word on the starter? Got to imagine Reimer.

number17
10-22-2014, 08:40 AM
Gotta think it'd be Reimer.

And I'd stop my 'let's lose and get Carlyle fired' campaign for 1 night ... there are a few teams I never want to lose to. ;)

Go Leafs!

corksens
10-22-2014, 08:49 AM
16 Clarke MacArthur 7 Kyle Turris 61 Mark Stone
6 Bobby Ryan 93 Mika Zibanejad 90 Alex Chiasson
68 Mike Hoffman 17 David Legwand 25 Chris Neil
9 Milan Michalek 15 Zack Smith 27 Curtis Lazar

Habsy
10-22-2014, 09:07 AM
16 Clarke MacArthur 7 Kyle Turris 61 Mark Stone
6 Bobby Ryan 93 Mika Zibanejad 90 Alex Chiasson
68 Mike Hoffman 17 David Legwand 25 Chris Neil
9 Milan Michalek 15 Zack Smith 27 Curtis Lazar

All not drafted by the Ottawa Senators. Bryan Murray scrambles to fix his mistakes often.

corksens
10-22-2014, 09:12 AM
Zuh?

MindzEye
10-22-2014, 09:26 AM
If history is any guide, Kadri and Kessel will combine for 17 goals tonight.

The question is whether we'll be able to keep Ottawa under that.

zeke
10-22-2014, 10:16 AM
1st Line

C T.Bozak (28): 7gms, 3gls, 7pts, 44.1cf%, 18:44 (82gms, 35gls, 82pts)
C K.Turris (25): 5gms, 1gls, 4pts, 46.5cf%, 18:13 (82gms, 16gls, 66pts)

W P.Kessel (27): 7gms, 4gls, 8pts, 41.5cf%, 19:24 (82gms, 47gls, 94pts)
W C.MacArthur (29): 5gms, 2gls, 4pts, ---cf%, 17:10 (82gms, 33gls, 66pts)

W J.Vanriemsdyk (25): 7gms, 3gls, 5pts, 43.3cf%, 19:21 (82gms, 35gls, 59pts)
W M.Stone (22): 5gms, 1gls, 2pts, ---cf%, 13:48 (82gms, 16gls, 33pts)

2nd Line

C N.Kadri (24): 7gms, 2gls, 2pts, 55.3cf%, 16:21 (82gms, 23gls, 23pts)
C M.Zibanejad (21): 5gms, 0gls, 0pts, ---cf%, 15:12 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

W J.Lupul (31): 7gms, 2gls, 3pts, 56.1cf%, 18:08 (82gms, 23gls, 35pts)
W B.Ryan (27): 5gms, 1gls, 2pts, ---cf%, 15:45 (82gms, 16gls, 33pts)

W D.Winnik (29): 7gms, 0gls, 2pts, 57.1cf%, 16:03 (82gms, 0gls, 23pts)
W A.Chiasson (24): 5gms, 1gls, 2pts, ---cf%, 15:24 (82gms, 16gls, 33pts)

3rd Line

C M.Santorelli (29): 7gms, 1gls, 4pts, 51.6cf%, 12:35 (82gms, 12gls, 47pts)
C D.Legwand (34): 5gms, 2gls, 3pts, ---cf%, 15:59 (82gms, 33gls, 49pts)

W L.Komarov (27): 7gms, 0gls, 5pts, 53.3cf%, 15:20 (82gms, 0gls, 59pts)
W M.Hoffman (25): 3gms, 1gls, 2pts, ---cf%, 13:08 (82gms, 27gls, 55pts)

W D.Clarkson (30): 7gms, 2gls, 3pts, 51.9cf%, 15:19 (82gms, 23gls, 35pts)
W C.Neil (35): 5gms, 1gls, 3pts, ---cf%, 10:58 (82gms, 16gls, 49pts)

4th Line

C P.Holland (23): 7gms, 0gls, 1pts, ---cf%, 8:50 (82gms, 0gls, 12pts)
C Z.Smith (26): 5gms, 1gls, 1pts, 50.0cf%, 14:24 (82gms, 16gls, 16pts)

W R.Panik (23): 6gms, 0gls, 0pts, ---cf%, 6:28 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
W M.Michalek (30): 5gms, 0gls, 0pts, ---cf%, 16:20 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

-------
W C.Lazar (19): 4gms, 0gls, 1pts, ---cf%, 14:47 (82gms, 0gls, 21pts)



1st Pair

D D.Phaneuf (29): 7gms, 0gls, 3pts, 53.4cf%, 22:56 (82gms, 0gls, 35pts)
D E.Karlsson (24): 5gms, 2gls, 4pts, 47.6cf%, 26:54 (82gms, 33gls, 98pts)

D C.Franson (27): 5gms, 1gls, 2pts, 50.0cf%, 19:11 (82gms, 16gls, 33pts)
D C.Phillips (36): 5gms, 0gls, 1pts, 38.8cf%, 23:05 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)

2nd Pair

D S.Percy (21): 6gms, 0gls, 3pts, 45.9cf%, 19:34 (82gms, 0gls, 41pts)
D C.Ceci (21): 5gms, 0gls, 2pts, 38.4cf%, 18:47 (82gms, 0gls, 33pts)

D R.Polak (28): 7gms, 1gls, 1pts, 48.2cf%, 20:30 (82gms, 12gls, 12pts)
D P.Wiercioch (24): 3gms, 0gls, 0pts, ---cf%, 18:21 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)


3rd Pair

D J.Gardiner (24): 5gms, 0gls, 1pts, 46.7cf%, 20:28 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)
D E.Gryba (26): 5gms, 0gls, 0pts, 46.2cf%, 15:10 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

D M.Rielly (20): 7gs, 1gls, 2pts, 46.4cf%, 18:37 (82gms, 12gls, 23pts)
D M.Borowiecki (25): 5gms, 0gls, 1pts, 48.2cf%, 15:09 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)

D S.Robidas (37): 6gms, 0gls, 2pts, 45.5cf%, 16:59 (82gms, 0gls, 27pts)
-------



Starting Goalie

G J.Reimer (26): 3gms, .906sv%
G C.Anderson (33): 3gms, .939sv%

Backup Goalie

G J.Bernier (26): 4gms, .915sv%
G R.Lehner (23): 2gms, .950sv%



Injured/Suspended

W D.Booth (29): -----
W B.Kozun (24): 5gms, 0gls, 1pts, ---cf%, 8:54 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)

D M.Methot (29): ------

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 11:01 AM
I don't think this game is gonna be played tonight.

Deckie007
10-22-2014, 11:03 AM
I suspect you are correct.

leafman101
10-22-2014, 11:03 AM
**** that, then the terrorists win.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 11:05 AM
Should move the game to Kingston...

corksens
10-22-2014, 11:05 AM
TBD on that front.

Team 1200 said the league is playing the game as of now, but will continue to monitor.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 11:06 AM
@Hope_Smoke: Dreger "League will not put anyone at risk. Leafs are in lock down mode"

Killer93
10-22-2014, 11:07 AM
Scary situation, hope everyone stays safe in Ottawa from this board

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 11:58 AM
Leafs are staying at the Westin in Ottawa, they could hear the shots from their hotel rooms.

LeafGm
10-22-2014, 12:33 PM
Unless there's still an ongoing security situation by this afternoon, I'd be pretty surprised if they don't go ahead with this game.

zeke
10-22-2014, 12:34 PM
I dunno. this is a pretty big deal.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 12:39 PM
They postponed the game in Boston after that terrorist attack, why is this different?

MyNameIsJonas
10-22-2014, 12:43 PM
I'm a little surprised it hasnt been announced as cancelled already.

worm
10-22-2014, 12:47 PM
They postponed the game in Boston after that terrorist attack, why is this different?

City was on lockdown.

NHL said they will follow whatever local authorities say. So far they have not said anything.

I was more shocked by the lack of police at the Edmonton City Hall.

LeafGm
10-22-2014, 12:49 PM
Every situation is different, so I don't think it necessarily follows that because they postponed in Boston, that's what will happen here.

Though on further investigation, apparently Scotiabank place has no events booked for tomorrow. And then the Sens and Leafs both don't play again until Saturday. So, it would be pretty easy for the NHL to just reschedule the game for tomorrow.

zeke
10-22-2014, 12:50 PM
I mean, our parliament buildings were just invaded.

MyNameIsJonas
10-22-2014, 12:57 PM
I mean, our parliament buildings were just invaded.

yeah this.

SENSible
10-22-2014, 01:02 PM
Doubt they will postpone the game, but i really don't care one way or the other.

I'd like to show the terrorists they have no power, but can see the case for cancelling to remove a potential target.

If they do run the game, I can see extra violence between drunken fans from both teams with people being on edge.

LeafGm
10-22-2014, 01:05 PM
Doubt they will postpone the game, but i really don't care one way or the other.

I'd like to show the terrorists they have no power, but can see the case for cancelling to remove a potential target.

If they do run the game, I can see extra violence between drunken fans from both teams with people being on edge.
I seriously doubt it. If anything, an event like this is a reminder of how trivial a hockey rivalry is in the grand scheme of things.

zeke
10-22-2014, 01:10 PM
Chris Johnston @reporterchris
The NHL has decided to postpone tonight's #sens-#leafs game in Ottawa. The right decision. The only decision.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 01:10 PM
No make up date announced.

Rumpleforeskin
10-22-2014, 01:11 PM
TSN Hockey ‏@TSNHockey 16s17 seconds ago
Sens/Leafs game tonight has been postponed. Rescheduled game will be announced at a later date. #TSN #NHL

there we go

SENSible
10-22-2014, 01:12 PM
You may be correct and I hope you are. I'm just relaying the atmosphere at my school.

Habsy
10-22-2014, 01:19 PM
I mean, our parliament buildings were just invaded.

I blame the Republicans and Canada's loose gun laws.

CRL
10-22-2014, 01:20 PM
I blame the Republicans and Canada's loose gun laws.
in which part of Canada gun laws are loose?

Deckie007
10-22-2014, 01:22 PM
in which part of Canada gun laws are loose?

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/54/54d0a6cdc1ec2b211782191901b383c087d9dc9384c20f0194 4b014f1e33a8b4.jpg

MindzEye
10-22-2014, 01:24 PM
Anyone heard from Ja Rule?

LeafGm
10-22-2014, 01:27 PM
I blame the Republicans and Canada's loose gun laws.
We're pretty lucky we don't have America's gun laws. Otherwise, it's a pretty safe bet that the guy that stormed parliament would have done it with a little more firepower than one long-barrel hunting rifle.

Volcanologist
10-22-2014, 01:28 PM
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=735664&navid=nhl:topheads

Officially postponed.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 01:28 PM
@Zeisberger: Initial indications are that the game will not be rescheduled for tomorrow although that has yet to be confirmed. #Sens #Leafs

worm
10-22-2014, 01:33 PM
I seriously doubt it. If anything, an event like this is a reminder of how trivial a hockey rivalry is in the grand scheme of things.

Exactly. Everybody would be all lovey talking about what happened at parliment hill.

Metalleaf
10-22-2014, 01:38 PM
@jonasTSN1050: Leafs release statement: "We have been witness today to some terrible events, but are thankful to those brave men and women for their tireless service in protecting everyone’s safety."

TheCountofMonteCristo
10-22-2014, 03:37 PM
Exactly. Everybody would be all lovey talking about what happened at parliment hill.
Cork and KB will lovingly hug King Tucker

blacksheep
10-23-2014, 03:27 AM
If they do run the game, I can see extra violence between drunken fans from both teams with people being on edge.

Well, there was that time TuckerFan claimed she was raped...

JackBurton
10-23-2014, 05:00 PM
I remember that.

JohnnyHolmes
10-23-2014, 10:08 PM
I remember that.

Chloroform?

Pronger84
10-23-2014, 10:51 PM
The game is now going to be played at 6pm on Sunday november 9th

blacksheep
10-24-2014, 12:40 AM
Chloroform?

Lol. Yep

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:31 AM
Time for a reboot.

https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F2.bp.blogspot.com%2F-1dUyC88_JFM%2FTdo6u4PSo5I%2FAAAAAAAAAcU%2FRtir2Pf4 Kfk%2Fs1600%2FBigDogLittleDog.jpg&f=1

Rumpleforeskin
11-09-2014, 09:44 AM
Go Leafs Go

Komarov with the hat trick

LeafGm
11-09-2014, 10:04 AM
Trevor Smith recalled from the Marlies, for some reason.

Metalleaf
11-09-2014, 10:15 AM
Well he can't be much worse than Frattin.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 10:18 AM
Looks like Holland was hurt last night

leaffan2005
11-09-2014, 10:20 AM
Damn they are going down like flies. Holland, Winnik and Lupul all out. Wing depth is starting to wane.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 10:27 AM
Booth, Kozun, Lupul, Winnik, and now Holland.

leafman101
11-09-2014, 10:29 AM
Holland might be fine. With Winnik out need an extra guy for the road. They've been travelling with 13 forwards and 7 dmen all season.

Metalleaf
11-09-2014, 11:40 AM
http://youtu.be/qPxtQs0OfwU

CaptainBolduke
11-09-2014, 02:50 PM
All not drafted by the Ottawa Senators. Bryan Murray scrambles to fix his mistakes often.

The Leafs are pretty much the same. To be a good team you must build through the draft.

Pronger84
11-09-2014, 03:04 PM
Yup that's right, drafting is how to truly build a solid team. I was watching the leafs vs Detroit game and Healy made a good point, Detroit had 16 of their current 22 players drafted In their lineup and been in the playoffs for 23 consecutive seasons vs us who only has 5 of our draft picks out of 22 players in the lineup and only made the dance once in 10 years.

SundinsTooth
11-09-2014, 03:09 PM
Holy Christ. Healy is now being quoted as a voice of reason.

Pronger84
11-09-2014, 03:11 PM
Holy Christ. Healy is now being quoted as a voice of reason.

He did make a good point about drafting lol.

KingTucker
11-09-2014, 04:00 PM
Yup that's right, drafting is how to truly build a solid team. I was watching the leafs vs Detroit game and Healy made a good point, Detroit had 16 of their current 22 players drafted In their lineup and been in the playoffs for 23 consecutive seasons vs us who only has 5 of our draft picks out of 22 players in the lineup and only made the dance once in 10 years.

Detroit also had a Hall of Fame level centre and defenceman, those helped a bit. Healy is still a tool though.

zeke
11-09-2014, 04:07 PM
ccf% = Zone-start Adjusted 5v5 Close percentage
cf% = Zone-start Adjusted 5v5 Total percentage


Line 1

C T.Bozak (28): 14gms, 5gls, 12pts, 45.0ccf%, 45.1cf%, 19:17 (82gms, 29gls, 70pts) ---- 55.8fo%
C K.Turris (25): 13gms, 1gls, 7pts, 43.3ccf%, 46.1cf%, 19:31 (82gms, 6gls, 44pts) ---- 47.9fo%

W P.Kessel (27): 14gms, 8gls, 19pts, 48.3ccf%, 47.6cf%, 18:46 (82gms, 47gls, 111pts)
W C.MacArthur (29): 13gms, 7gls, 10pts, 44.6ccf%, 45.8cf%, 17:58 (82gms, 44gls, 63pts)

W J.Vanriemsdyk (25): 14gms, 5gls, 10pts, 45.5ccf%, 44.5cf%, 20:00 (82gms, 29gls, 59pts)
W E.Condra (28): 6gms, 0gls, 0pts, 47.4ccf%, 48.7cf%, 12:20 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

Line 2

C N.Kadri (24): 14gms, 4gls, 7pts, 59.4ccf%, 57.1cf%, 16:15 (82gms, 23gls, 41pts) ---- 47.9fo%
C C.Lazar (19): 11gms, 0gls, 4pts, 52.6ccf%, 50.0cf%, 12:47 (82gms, 0gls, 30pts) ---- 52.7fo%

W D.Clarkson (30): 14gms, 3gls, 4pts, 49.0ccf%, 48.9cf%, 16:02 (82gms, 18gls, 23pts)
W M.Stone (22): 12gms, 3gls, 7pts, 54.4ccf%, 54.0cf%, 13:50 (82gms, 21gls, 48pts)

W R.Panik (23): 13gms, 3gls, 4pts, 50.0ccf%, 45.1cf%, 8:41 (82gms, 19gls, 25pts)
W M.Hoffman (25): 10gms, 3gls, 4pts, 53.4ccf%, 51.9cf%, 12:44 (82gms, 25gls, 33pts)

Line 3

C P.Holland (23): 14gms, 2gls, 4pts, 48.2ccf%, 44.4cf%, 11:34 (82gms, 12gls, 23pts) ---- 43.6fo%
C D.Legwand (34): 13gms, 2gls, 5pts, 39.7ccf%, 40.9cf%, 16:41 (82gms, 13gls, 32pts) ---- 50.0fo%

W L.Komarov (27): 14gms, 1gls, 9pts, 49.4ccf%, 50.2cf%, 15:57 (82gms, 6gls, 53pts)
W Z.Smith (26): 13gms, 2gls, 2pts, 47.9ccf%, 48.6cf%, 13:21 (82gms, 13gls, 13pts)

W M.Santorelli (29): 14gms, 1gls, 6pts, 50.0ccf%, 50.8cf%, 13:04 (82gms, 6gls, 35pts)
W C.Neil (35): 13gms, 2gls, 4pts, 39.2ccf%, 41.0cf%, 11:02 (82gms, 13gls, 25pts)

Line 4

C S.Carrick (22): 4gms, 0gls, 0pts, 34.6ccf%, 33.3cf%, 5:49 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts) ---- 56.0fo%
C M.Zibanejad (21): 13gms, 2gls, 3pts, 44.1ccf%, 44.3cf%, 14:53 (82gms, 13gls, 19pts) ---- 48.8fo%

W M.Frattin (26): 6gms, 0gls, 0pts, 43.1ccf%, 45.6cf%, 7:02 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
W M.Michalek (30): 13gms, 1gls, 4pts, 47.2ccf%, 47.1cf%, 16:16 (82gms, 6gls, 25pts)

W J.Leivo (21): 1gms, 0gls, 0pts, 55.6ccf%, 55.6cf%, 6:59 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
W C.Greening (28): 3gms, 0gls, 0pts, 47.7ccf%, 50.9cf%, 11:22 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)


Pair 1

D D.Phaneuf (29): 14gms, 1gls, 6pts, 52.2ccf%, 50.4cf%, 23:13 (82gms, 6gls, 35pts)
D E.Karlsson (24): 13gms, 4gls, 10pts, 46.8ccf%, 48.1cf%, 27:30 (82gms, 25gls, 63pts)

D C.Franson (27): 12gms, 2gls, 7pts, 54.2ccf%, 50.7cf%, 19:52 (82gms, 14gls, 48pts)
D J.Cowen (23): 8gms, 0gls, 0pts, 40.5ccf%, 42.1cf%, 18:58 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

Pair 2

D M.Rielly (20): 13gms, 1gls, 4pts, 53.8ccf%, 49.9cf%, 18:55 (82gms, 6gls, 25pts)
D C.Ceci (21): 13gms, 0gls, 5pts, 39.7ccf%, 41.0cf%, 18:51 (82gms, 0gls, 32pts)

D R.Polak (28): 14gms, 2gls, 2pts, 52.1ccf%, 48.6cf%, 21:07 (82gms, 12gls, 12pts)
D P.Wiercioch (24): 10gms, 1gls, 3pts, 52.8ccf%, 50.8cf%, 16:14 (82gms, 8gls, 25pts)

Pair 3

D J.Gardiner (24): 12gms, 1gls, 3pts, 45.4ccf%, 48.1cf%, 18:47 (82gms, 7gls, 21pts)
D E.Gryba (26): 13gms, 0gls, 1pts, 46.6ccf%, 45.8cf%, 15:18 (82gms, 0gls, 6pts)

D S.Robidas (37): 13gms, 0gls, 2pts, 45.3ccf%, 47.7cf%, 17:07 (82gms, 0gls, 13pts)
D M.Borowiecki (25): 10gms, 0gls, 1pts, 51.6ccf%, 48.8cf%, 15:14 (82gms, 0gls, 8pts)



Starting Goalies

G J.Reimer (26): 6gms, .925sv%
G R.Lehner (23): 5gms, .927sv%

Backup Goalies

G J.Bernier (26): 10gms, .913sv%
G C.Anderson (33): 8gms, .951sv%



Injured / Suspended

W J.Lupul (31): 9gms, 2gls, 3pts, 65.1ccf%, 59.8cf%, 18:09 (82gms, 18gls, 27pts)
W D.Winnik (29): 13gms, 1gls, 7pts, 60.0ccf%, 54.2cf%, 15:07 (82gms, 6gls, 44pts)
W B.Kozun (24): 5gms, 0gls, 1pts, 32.3ccf%, 36.2cf%, 8:54 (82gms, 0gls, 16pts)
W C.Ashton (23): 3gms, 0gls, 0pts, 56.3ccf%, 50.0cf%, 6:09 (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)
W D.Booth (30): -----

W B.Ryan (27): 12gms, 3gls, 7pts, 37.6ccf%, 40.2cf%, 17:12 (82gms, 21gls, 48pts)
W A.Chiasson (24): 11gms, 3gls, 7pts, 39.7ccf%, 40.1cf%, 15:23 (82gms, 22gls, 52pts)
D M.Methot (29): ---
D C.Phillips (36): 11gms, 0gls, 1pts, 40.1ccf%, 43.0cf%, 23:13 (82gms, 0gls, 8pts)

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 04:29 PM
Los Angeles won the cup last season with 4 of their best 5 forwards coming to the club via trade or FA.

You don't have to "build through the draft" or any other simplistic trope, you have to acquire more talent than your competitors. Whether you do it via draft, trade, or free agency doesn't matter one ****ing bit. Your club is a cumulative creation of every decision made, draft, trade, & FA. **** up in any one of the 3 and you devalue strong decisions made in the others. Excel in all 3 and you're likely playing deep into the playoffs with regularity. **** up more than 1 and you're likely on the other end of the spectrum for a long time.

JackBurton
11-09-2014, 04:31 PM
LA's rebuilding looked like a bust before they hired Sutter as coach, and traded for Carter/Richards.

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 04:36 PM
"building through the draft" seems to be really synonymous with being lucky enough to suck in the right seasons.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 04:36 PM
Los Angeles won the cup last season with 4 of their best 5 forwards coming to the club via trade or FA.

You don't have to "build through the draft" or any other simplistic trope, you have to acquire more talent than your competitors. Whether you do it via draft, trade, or free agency doesn't matter one ****ing bit. Your club is a cumulative creation of every decision made, draft, trade, & FA. **** up in any one of the 3 and you devalue strong decisions made in the others. Excel in all 3 and you're likely playing deep into the playoffs with regularity. **** up more than 1 and you're likely on the other end of the spectrum for a long time.

Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick were drafted by them. If we magically added those 4 to our team with what we have, we've be winning the cup this year. We are missing those drafted pieces.

Rielly, Nylander, Kadri are looking good, but not on that level.

There is no true way to build a team. Best formula in my eyes is "get the best players you can, with the best coach you can". We need to get more good players.

zeke
11-09-2014, 04:38 PM
brown is crap.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 04:39 PM
Los Angeles won the cup last season with 4 of their best 5 forwards coming to the club via trade or FA.

You don't have to "build through the draft" or any other simplistic trope, you have to acquire more talent than your competitors. Whether you do it via draft, trade, or free agency doesn't matter one ****ing bit. Your club is a cumulative creation of every decision made, draft, trade, & FA. **** up in any one of the 3 and you devalue strong decisions made in the others. Excel in all 3 and you're likely playing deep into the playoffs with regularity. **** up more than 1 and you're likely on the other end of the spectrum for a long time.

I absolutely does matter. You build value through drafting and development that is very hard to do via trades or FAs. Who are these 4 forwards anyhow? I see no FAs there, but some guys that were acquired by trading assets they'd developed or picks they could afford to give up due to a good pipeline.

JackBurton
11-09-2014, 04:39 PM
It is luck. Edmonton really didn't tank at the right time. Hall/RNH and Yakupov are nice young pieces, but rather weak as 1st overall selections.

When I hear people say tank like the Pens, I want to scream.

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 04:43 PM
Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick were drafted by them. If we magically added those 4 to our team with what we have, we've be winning the cup this year. We are missing those drafted pieces.

Well sure, when you get to add a bunch of high draft picks for nothing, you're going to be better. We'd be better if we simply hadn't pissed away kids we had drafted. How much better would the last few seasons have been with Rask and Steen in the lineup? How about if we were the team to trade up to get Logan Couture with the 1st we traded for Toskala?


Rielly, Nylander, Kadri are looking good, but not on that level.

Not only the level of Brown & Quick? I beg to differ.


There is no true way to build a team. Best formula in my eyes is "get the best players you can, with the best coach you can". We need to get more good players.

This I agree with. Compile the biggest pile of talent you can, put a shit ton of money into scouting and player development, make smart FA additions (like the Winnik's and Santorelli's of the world that are available every July for cheap) generate and then trade from roster surpluses to add impact talent whenever possible.

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 04:43 PM
I absolutely does matter. You build value through drafting and development that is very hard to do via trades or FAs. Who are these 4 forwards anyhow?

Carter, Richards, Gaborik, Williams

AKA, the majority of their top 6



I see no FAs there, but some guys that were acquired by trading assets they'd developed or picks they could afford to give up due to a good pipeline.

People tend to ignore the trading picks and kids for established players bit when they're analyze the Leafs....but it's cool when LA does it?

Pronger84
11-09-2014, 04:46 PM
Yes, and both players you mentioned were drafted by the wings. Yep, healy is a dolt lol but every dolt has his moments.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 04:48 PM
Carter, Richards, Gaborik, Williams
Not an FA among them.


People tend to ignore the trading picks and kids for established players bit when they're analyze the Leafs....but it's cool when LA does it?

They traded a 2nd and a 3rd for Gaborik ... with a solid pipeline in place, as is evidenced by the play of their young players this season. This is miles different from what the Leafs have been doing over the past decade. Only now do they have a pipeline that's even moderately good.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 04:57 PM
Well sure, when you get to add a bunch of high draft picks for nothing, you're going to be better. We'd be better if we simply hadn't pissed away kids we had drafted. How much better would the last few seasons have been with Rask and Steen in the lineup? How about if we were the team to trade up to get Logan Couture with the 1st we traded for Toskala?

Thats what i mean by adding them to our current team. Previous management left us with nothing for prospects. Steen Rask and Logan Couture added to this roster would send up to elite territory for sure.

If our previous management wasn't so inept at asset management we wouldn't be where we are today. We are in a decent spot, but we definitely need more. A top center and a top RHD defender to play with Phaneuf is exactly what this team needs.

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 04:59 PM
Not an FA among them.

Not sure what your point is....good teams add free agents every year.




They traded a 2nd and a 3rd for Gaborik ... with a solid pipeline in place, as is evidenced by the play of their young players this season. This is miles different from what the Leafs have been doing over the past decade. Only now do they have a pipeline that's even moderately good.

Again, not sure what your point is. This is not "building through the draft" in the way it's used colloquially. LA had a need that they couldn't fill in house and had to do opposite. Again, 4 of their top 5 forwards were not drafted by them...that is not this ridiculously strict adherence to "building through the draft" that gets stroked to so often in the hockey media.

MindzEye
11-09-2014, 05:00 PM
Thats what i mean by adding them to our current team. Previous management left us with nothing for prospects. Steen Rask and Logan Couture added to this roster would send up to elite territory for sure.

If our previous management wasn't so inept at asset management we wouldn't be where we are today. We are in a decent spot, but we definitely need more. A top center and a top RHD defender to play with Phaneuf is exactly what this team needs.

Yeah, agreed. But it really doesn't matter how we get them, just that we do get them.

leafman101
11-09-2014, 05:03 PM
Drafting is the cheapest and easiest way to get players. You get 7 picks every year, give or take a few. You don't get that many opportunities in trades or free agency. And when you do get those opportunities they are costly. Its a necessity to be good at drafting to build a contender. You can make some additions in trades and free agency too, but you need the drafting to make the trades, and you can't build a good roster on the trade and free agent markets alone. You won't end up with enough players.

Its impossible to do it without drafting and developing players well. And if you draft well you can manage to be good beyond eras of a group of players. A good development system is the foundation of a franchise.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 05:16 PM
Not sure what your point is....good teams add free agents every year.

Sorry, I thought it was obvious. To acquire a player through a trade requires assets. Free agents require only money and cap space.


Again, not sure what your point is. This is not "building through the draft" in the way it's used colloquially. LA had a need that they couldn't fill in house and had to do opposite. Again, 4 of their top 5 forwards were not drafted by them...that is not this ridiculously strict adherence to "building through the draft" that gets stroked to so often in the hockey media.

I was responding to your claim that it doesn't matter one iota whether a player is acquired through the draft, trades or free agency. No team builds a contender simply through drafting and development. That doesn't make the other means equal; they are not. As I pointed out, you can build value through the former, but relatively little through the latter.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:06 PM
frattin out, smith in.

bobby ryan is also in.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 06:17 PM
Another beauty start.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:18 PM
jvr flying the zone too early.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 06:18 PM
Weak play by Riley results in a sweet snipe by Hoffman.

Volcanologist
11-09-2014, 06:23 PM
Reminds me of the Wilson days, always giving up the first goal.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:23 PM
too bad because leivo really shoulda buried that great feed from jake. great save be lehner.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 06:27 PM
I think they've responded pretty well after the goal against. That was a nice shift by the big line.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:28 PM
that's a couple pimp shifts there.

rated
11-09-2014, 06:28 PM
lively home crowd for the leafs

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 06:28 PM
Yup, looking good now. CORSIing the shit outta them.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:30 PM
nice to see the fourth line getting regular shifts. they look good. good riddance to frattin.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:43 PM
heh. i'll take it.

Jeremy
11-09-2014, 06:43 PM
Yeahhhh buddy!

Equalizer!

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:44 PM
cool shot of the bench reaction there - jvr amd phil knew it was in right away.

goalscorers know.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 06:44 PM
MOAR Holland.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 06:44 PM
Holland 1-1!!

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 06:44 PM
Holland delivers.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 06:46 PM
Love that line., has some finish now with Clarkson off of it.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 06:47 PM
Bullshit.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 06:48 PM
That was the penalty...?

Wish I had another look at that.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:48 PM
jvr gets pickpocketed, then takes the penalty.

jvr at fault on both goals.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 06:48 PM
Reimer should've had that.

BUm

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 06:48 PM
Short side eh, Reimer.

CRL
11-09-2014, 06:49 PM
save would be nice some time

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:54 PM
kadri's great game last rewarded by.....getting 4th line minutes tonight.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 06:55 PM
Our top line is absolutely atrocious defensively; absolute joke

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 06:57 PM
Our top line is absolutely atrocious defensively; absolute joke

Which is why they shouldn't be playing together.

zeke
11-09-2014, 06:58 PM
bozak 6:02 (18:06) - 67%
kessel 6:02 (18:06)
vanryk 5:39 (16:57)

holland 6:02 (18:06) - 29%
santo 5:42 (17:06)
komo 5:26 (16:18)

carrick 4:27 (13:21) - 33%
smith 4:43 (14:09)
leivo 4:41 (14:03)

kadri 3:40 (11:00) - 50%
panik 4:01 (12:03)
clarkson 3:35 (10:45)

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 06:59 PM
I don't see anyone complaining when they are dominating the offensive zone.

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:01 PM
phaneuf 7:18 (21:54)
franson 5:49 (17:27)

robidas 7:06 (21:18)
gardiner 7:02 (21:06)

rielly 6:25 (19:15)
polak 6:20 (19:00)

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:13 PM
Don't recall Rielly doing much of that shit before Randy scratched him.

Cojo
11-09-2014, 07:13 PM
It certainly would be great if one of our goalies stepped up this season. So far both have been very mediocre.

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:14 PM
not a banner night for the goalies.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 07:15 PM
JVR taketh and giveth away.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:16 PM
Is my feed delayed ... James just made a brilliant save before JVR's goal?

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 07:17 PM
This team drives me crazy.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 07:18 PM
sigh...

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:20 PM
It's a barn burner.

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:20 PM
LOL how many more goals we gonna see today?

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:21 PM
great play by smith. great play.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 07:21 PM
Battle of Ontario Episode I, Attack of the Sieves

Jeremy
11-09-2014, 07:21 PM
Nice tip by Leivo

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:21 PM
Yeah, very nice play by Smith. Nice to have the callups contribute.

#depth

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 07:21 PM
Nice goal by Lupul Jr.

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:22 PM
time to take a lead

Jeremy
11-09-2014, 07:30 PM
Santo Claus

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:30 PM
holland's got skills.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 07:30 PM
Wowwwwww.

Leo looks so depressed he missed out on that.

WellPlayed
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
Great pass by Holland.

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
LOL Holland made hotCarl his beyach

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
Holland = SH God.

TimHorton
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
Hot Karl just got Hollanded.

Feyd
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
haha, great defensive play by Hot Karl. NOT.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND HOLLAND

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Flag_of_the_Netherlands.svg/900px-Flag_of_the_Netherlands.svg.png

SundinsTooth
11-09-2014, 07:31 PM
Hot Karl looked confused there. Thank god that wasn't Phaneuf or we would have to lynch him.

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:33 PM
no credit given by the commentator to holland on the play. not for the little puck tap then stick tap to cause the turnover, not for drawing two guys and dropping it perfectly for the goal.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 07:35 PM
Hot Karl looked confused there. Thank god that wasn't Phaneuf or we would have to lynch him.

Hot Karl gets a pass because he racks up the points. Defense has never been his strong suit.

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:36 PM
so nice to see a real fourth line for the first time since quinn.

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:37 PM
bummer is that we're actually playing like crap tonight. this has not been a good game.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 07:40 PM
Holy penalties...

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:40 PM
BS call

SundinsTooth
11-09-2014, 07:40 PM
Hot Karl gets a pass because he racks up the points. Defense has never been his strong suit.

Phaneuf never seems to get a pass....

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 07:40 PM
bummer is that we're actually playing like crap tonight. this has not been a good game.

Fun as hell though to watch.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:40 PM
Pretty iffy penalty there.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 07:42 PM
Not one to complain about the refs, but considering what the Rangers were doing last night in the third, that's brutal.

SundinsTooth
11-09-2014, 07:42 PM
Pretty damn nice pk'ng here.

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:43 PM
Pretty damn nice pk'ng here.

need PP to cheap in

zeke
11-09-2014, 07:45 PM
ottawa will break if we score here.

CRL
11-09-2014, 07:46 PM
Dion is terrible on PP or PK

Bleedsblue&white
11-09-2014, 07:46 PM
Its amazing what you can do when you fight for every inch of ice.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:47 PM
Sure hope dimwit is saving Kadri for the third.

SundinsTooth
11-09-2014, 07:47 PM
Icing..grr. Guess it was worth a shot.

da_next_kid
11-09-2014, 07:49 PM
These sens commentators are just the worst. Worse than Jim Hughson.

SENSible
11-09-2014, 07:54 PM
Shit game so far. Lehner has been brutal to give the Leafs a chance.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 07:55 PM
Phaneuf never seems to get a pass....

I take it back, they are trashing Hot Karl right now on SN. Big time.

SENSible
11-09-2014, 07:56 PM
Karlsson deserves the rip job. Effort tonight has been horrible. He misses Alfie and his work ethic leading the way.

Feyd
11-09-2014, 07:59 PM
Dion's playing a pretty solid game tonight.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 07:59 PM
It's unusual to see a broadcast lay into an opposition player during a Leafs broadcast ... can't remember that happening since ... ever. Granted, it's very low hanging fruit.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:05 PM
Since Holland has gone from <10 minutes per game to 15+, he's at a ppg clip.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 08:11 PM
Where was the extra player?...

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:12 PM
No idea why the Leafs got a penalty.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:12 PM
Smith has been good on the pk tonight.

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 08:14 PM
Since Holland has gone from <10 minutes per game to 15+, he's at a ppg clip.

I ****ing love being right.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 08:14 PM
Yea so when does Frattin get waived?

TimHorton
11-09-2014, 08:14 PM
Big goal there boys!!!

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 08:14 PM
REILLY!!!!

KADRI DID ALL THE WORK.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:14 PM
Nice. Rielly makes up for some shaky play earlier.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 08:15 PM
Morgan healthy scratch Rielly

Deckie007
11-09-2014, 08:15 PM
Nice shot Morgan and screen Clarkie!

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:15 PM
I ****ing love being right.

I think everyone but Randy knew he had potential. That goodness for injuries, I guess.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:16 PM
Clarkson may have tipped that.

zeke
11-09-2014, 08:16 PM
kadri with another invisible third assist. he's had a bunch of those.

Feyd
11-09-2014, 08:16 PM
Nice screen & tip by Clarkson.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 08:18 PM
I was totally wrong about Clarkson. I thought there was no hope for him. But he's bringing it every night and a useful contributor. Pretty pleased.

zeke
11-09-2014, 08:19 PM
crazy save.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 08:23 PM
I was totally wrong about Clarkson. I thought there was no hope for him. But he's bringing it every night and a useful contributor. Pretty pleased.

I agree with you.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:24 PM
James 'China Wall' Reimer.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 08:25 PM
Reimer has Ottawa's number.

Jeremy
11-09-2014, 08:25 PM
King James!

zeke
11-09-2014, 08:30 PM
gotta love running up 5gls on pretty much all depth scoring.

no pts from kessel, kadri, bozak, lupul, phaneuf, gardiner.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:33 PM
Leafs are starting to sit back.

#randyspecial

WellPlayed
11-09-2014, 08:34 PM
Kessel....just threw a hit?

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:36 PM
Panik's last few games ... totally better player than the first bunch.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:40 PM
Reimer ... Mr. Third Period Onslaught.

zeke
11-09-2014, 08:41 PM
yikes. that was ugly.

reimer has clean outplayed bernier so far this yeat.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 08:42 PM
gotta love running up 5gls on pretty much all depth scoring.

no pts from kessel, kadri, bozak, lupul, phaneuf, gardiner.

We were do for a game like that. Great to see.

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-09-2014, 08:43 PM
yikes. that was ugly.

reimer has clean outplayed bernier so far this yeat.

Reimers problem is can he string together consecutive games. Everytime it looks like he could take over, he falls on his face.

LeafGm
11-09-2014, 08:44 PM
The Leafs have scored 10 goals in the last 24 hours, and Phil Kessel's only been in on one of them.

Good to see the supporting cast stepping up.

zeke
11-09-2014, 08:48 PM
this is exactly the kind of game we lose if we're trotting out a goon 4th line and crap third line.

Killer93
11-09-2014, 08:48 PM
Supporting cast stepping up with a good amount of injuries (Lupul, Winnik, Kozun, Booth); Smith, Carrick and Leivo have no interest giving up their spots that easily based on tonights play.

BeLeafer
11-09-2014, 08:50 PM
Outside of Reimer, Phaneuf was probably the best player on the ice tonight. Holland was pretty damn good too.

leafman101
11-09-2014, 08:52 PM
The Leafs have scored 10 goals in the last 24 hours, and Phil Kessel's only been in on one of them.

Good to see the supporting cast stepping up.

Yep. Thats something that hasn't happened in a few years and was missing the first 10 or so games of this season. Nice to have the depth making contributions. And that is with a few injuries too.

Wayward DP
11-09-2014, 08:52 PM
Nice to see our forward depth contributing. Holland looks like he's taking a real step forward. Reimer should've had that first goal but was solid after that. Lehner was pretty crappy too though.

Hot Karl looked shitty, Naz had another strong game. I really don't like reuniting Kessel with JVR and Bozak, a) him and Naz were producing; b) that trio does not play any defence, they were on the ice for Ottawa's first two goals.

Franson, aside from his decreasing brain cramps, looks really good. Robidas had a strong game too.

Our bottom two lines were our best though, which is really encouraging to see. Smith made that fourth line playable, and I really like what Leivo brings too. Forward depth... cool.

hockeylover
11-09-2014, 08:52 PM
this is exactly the kind of game we lose if we're trotting out a goon 4th line and crap third line.

That is definitely true.

I think there's a few things to be really positive about with this lineup compared to last year but it's always a bit of an emotional rollercoaster watching with the defensive miscues.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 09:00 PM
Ottawa isn't a very good team. I don't care what the record says this early in the season.

SENSible
11-09-2014, 09:02 PM
Ottawa isn't a very good team. I don't care what the record says this early in the season.

The Leafs certainly bring out the worst in them.

Leafin'
11-09-2014, 09:14 PM
The Leafs certainly bring out the worst in them.

Don't get me wrong, Ottawa is in the same boat as the leafs. Inconsistent and not enough good hockey players. Karlsson getting shit on is no surprise as he has no one to play with, same song with Phaneuf.

SENSible
11-09-2014, 09:41 PM
The Sens have ridden hot goaltending to an inflated record. If Methot can come back and help shore up the D they can contend for the playoffs, but it could go sideways in a hurry if we get goaltending like tonight on a regular basis.

Wayward DP
11-09-2014, 11:12 PM
The Sens have ridden hot goaltending to an inflated record. If Methot can come back and help shore up the D they can contend for the playoffs, but it could go sideways in a hurry if we get goaltending like tonight on a regular basis.

Lehner didn't do you guys any favours tonight, but your first goal was one you'd like to see Reimer stop too. On the second goal Lehner gave up a bad rebound, but HK let JVR cruise to the net unimpeded and get the first whack at the puck. Can't blame Lehner on any of the other three goals really, got hung out to dry on the shortie, most goalies don't stop that Leivo redirect, and same with the Clarkson tip.

leaffan2005
11-10-2014, 12:06 AM
Hey, NHL counted this as a road win. They must not have seen the crowd there tonight.

Ah well, shit happens.

Metalleaf
11-10-2014, 01:05 AM
New trend?

http://38.media.tumblr.com/81fc224a09ea21a560b10a80996ea986/tumblr_net2ke3X8W1qcnk0to1_1280.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2Cu8I0IMAA3hUp.jpg

MapleLeafBlueJayBoy
11-10-2014, 01:44 AM
Phil looks totally confused.

JohnnyHolmes
11-10-2014, 02:55 AM
This was the game I watched the most of so far this season. Turned it off after Clarkson's goal.

Was this a bad game for Ottawa? I was pretty unimpressed. They lost almost every puck battle all night long, and Maclean did his best to ice 4 shitty lines instead of 2 good ones.

HK looked like a complete ass on that shorty. Embarrassing.

I thought Cowen looked alright, and even Greening had a decent game for his standards. He still did nothing, but wasn't completely useless out there. Just about though.

Too many mistakes to wait out in the lineup. Phillips, Greening and Neil are all wastes of roster spots at this point. Seeing any of those three on the PP should result in immediate dismissal.

BeLeafer
11-10-2014, 07:09 AM
I had to go back and check the boxscore to see if the great Clark MacArthur had actually played this one. Yep, 16+ minutes, 0 pts, -4.

JackBurton
11-10-2014, 08:10 AM
New trend?

http://38.media.tumblr.com/81fc224a09ea21a560b10a80996ea986/tumblr_net2ke3X8W1qcnk0to1_1280.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2Cu8I0IMAA3hUp.jpg

Looks like she'd blow Phil if he wanted.

SundinsTooth
11-10-2014, 08:10 AM
Reimer and Ottawa. What a beast.

corksens
11-10-2014, 08:22 AM
Brutal game. Absolute back breakers on those two first goals.

At least you guys know that Ottawa can easily skate with Toronto. Should go down to the wire this season when alot of ppl saw us as a risk for McDavid.

Reimer has the Tim Thomas gene - plays way over his head in Ottawa. I think we need to dim the lights or something...

corksens
11-10-2014, 08:23 AM
Don't blame Karlsson on that 3rd goal. He actually won the first battle but Turris didn't come up the boards to help. Could have easily taken the puck when it came loose but didn't reach.

number17
11-10-2014, 09:13 AM
Is the overall sentiment that it was a pretty good game vs. Ottawa? I must be in the minority then cause I am not pleased with this game.

Beating the Sens is always good, even if we were in tank-mode ... there's just something about Ottawa.

And it's good to get balanced offense from our 3rd, and even 4th lines. It's also great to see young guys like Carrick, Leivo called up - and making contribution on the big club.

I'm also very glad to see Komarov delivering on and off the scoresheet, great to see Clarkson redeeming himself from a terrible year.

All that said though, that's pretty much the end of positives for me. What irks me, despite getting 4 points over the 2 weekend games, are ...

- Leafs allow yet another early goal, and we appear not ready when the game starts yet again. Ottawa scored the first goal at 2:58 on Sunday, on Sat NYR scored 53 sec's into the game, and on Thur vs. Colorado we allowed goal in the first shift of the game, just 31 sec's after puck drop. All these early goals dig us a hole early on, and despite picking up 5 points over 3 games (we did have the luxury of playing 3 backup goalies in those games, and 3 pretty inconsistent teams) pretty sure getting behind a goal is NOT the way to start every game. We're very ill-prepared to start, and this is yet another disturbing trend that's carried on from last season.

- We've allowed a total of 110 shots over the 3 games, which is 37 shots per game. This is WAY TOO HIGH for us to sustain a winning record. Rewind to last season, after the 14 games streak that saw the Leafs dropped out from the playoff, Shanny came on board in the summer and said we can't play the 'swamp'. We can't allow this many shot on goals and expect to win. Randy's gotta change his system and play tighter defensively. Now, more than a month into the new season, I still see the swamp, I still see a very high SA total (Leafs rank 4th worst in the league, only better than Buffalo, Ottawa and Colorado, and worse than EDM, CAR FLA among other teams) ... so Randy and Shanny have delivered empty promises yet we continue to march on playing 'pond hockey' (as Shanny once called it)

- IMO Kadri has played very well over those past 3 games, yet his icetime has remain limited at ~ 14 min a game. Holland's the new darling of Carlyle and his minutes has crept up from 15-16 min to a season high 17:15 vs. Ottawa. Bozak, who briefly missed his boyfriend on his line is now fully re-united with Kessel in the default #1 line, and his minute is also up in the 17's. Randy's continued to trust Bozak as Kessel's setup man, despite Kadri actually did a better job as Kessel's center. Holland's been given the opportunities because of his size. I actually like Holland and Bozak, but I don't think Holland - 17 min, Bozak - 17 min and Kadri - 14 min is the best distribution of icetime for the team - now or future. Kadri's possession stats is much better than Bozak's, and limiting Kadri's icetime is one reason why we're getting so many shots against. Kadri's icetime was less than Bozak's, Holland's, and Santonrelli's vs. Ottawa.

- Overall the team continues to play very loose defense out there, from the frequent turnovers by our Dmen outlet pass, to coverage of our forwards. We continue to get hemmed in for long periods of time because of the 'swamp' system, we continue to give up way too many grade 'A' scoring chances. We relied on scoring 13 goals over the past 3 games to climb up in standing, but I don't believe that is sustainable.


All in all, it is good to see the W's, but to me it is very disturbing to see HOW we win these games. It's the same system, same team, same flaws, that inevitably will come back to bite us in the worst possible time just like last season, or the season before, or the playoff before ... after a summer where Shanny guaranteed changes are imminent, I am seeing too many of the same ol same ol's to be a happy fan 1 month into the season.

LeafGm
11-10-2014, 09:40 AM
Brutal game. Absolute back breakers on those two first goals.

At least you guys know that Ottawa can easily skate with Toronto. Should go down to the wire this season when alot of ppl saw us as a risk for McDavid.

Reimer has the Tim Thomas gene - plays way over his head in Ottawa. I think we need to dim the lights or something...
Last night wasn't one of those nights though---the Sens got a couple of real softies past him.

corksens
11-10-2014, 09:43 AM
Which ones?

zeke
11-10-2014, 09:44 AM
i agree we played like crap. that might have been ottawa's best possession game of the season. we made them look better than most any other team has so far. we're lucky lehner let in some stinkers and reimer shut the door.

people said we only beat the rags and isles because lundqvist and halak blew up, but we carried the play and scored a bunch of sweet goals in both those games and fully deserved the big wins.

this game, though, we really can credit their goalie with handing it to us.

the main culprit in our poor play this game? the recently reunited defensive abomination of a top line.

JohnnyHolmes
11-10-2014, 09:54 AM
Don't blame Karlsson on that 3rd goal. He actually won the first battle but Turris didn't come up the boards to help. Could have easily taken the puck when it came loose but didn't reach.

It was a powerplay...what is Turris supposed to do when Karlsson's weak ass bank off the boards can't even get past a guy semi-forechecking on a pk?

Then he gets turned inside out.

I don't see how that goal is on anyone but Karlsson. That was pretty shit.

zeke
11-10-2014, 10:10 AM
Which ones?

the first two were stoppable.

number17
11-10-2014, 10:10 AM
i agree we played like crap. that might have been ottawa's best possession game of the season. we made them look better than most any other team has so far. we're lucky lehner let in some stinkers and reimer shut the door.

people said we only beat the rags and isles because lundqvist and halak blew up, but we carried the play and scored a bunch of sweet goals in both those games and fully deserved the big wins.

this game, though, we really can credit their goalie with handing it to us.

the main culprit in our poor play this game? the recently reunited defensive abomination of a top line.I don't think that is the ONLY problem but I 120% agree, that IS A problem.

Kadri is a much better possession player than Bozak, and with him centering Kessel and JVR, he is, ironically, the SAFETY on that line. Bozak, OTOH, is very poor at possession, keeps giving the puck away, is lost in his defensive zone coverage, and takes high risk chances.

I'd MUCH, MUCH rather have kadri than Bozak in ES with #21 and #81, cause both of them are pretty mediocre (if even that) defensive players.

Giving Bozak 17 min of icetime with #21 and #81 is a BIG reason why we are so bad in possession. That does not explain all the other problems we had though.

zeke
11-10-2014, 10:11 AM
It was a powerplay...what is Turris supposed to do when Karlsson's weak ass bank off the boards can't even get past a guy semi-forechecking on a pk?

Then he gets turned inside out.

I don't see how that goal is on anyone but Karlsson. That was pretty shit.

see here's the thing on that play - most other dmen aren't even able to get to that puck in time. with most other dmen holland's probably in on a break.

the other factor is that your coach just played him near 30min in back to back games.

zeke
11-10-2014, 10:11 AM
I don't think that is the ONLY problem but I 120% agree, that IS A problem.

Kadri is a much better possession player than Bozak, and with him centering Kessel and JVR, he is, ironically, the SAFETY on that line. Bozak, OTOH, is very poor at possession, keeps giving the puck away, is lost in his defensive zone coverage, and takes high risk chances.

I'd MUCH, MUCH rather have kadri than Bozak in ES with #21 and #81, cause both of them are pretty mediocre (if even that) defensive players.

Giving Bozak 17 min of icetime with #21 and #81 is a BIG reason why we are so bad in possession. That does not explain all the other problems we had though.

thing is, Bozak and JVR looked much better possession-wise without Kessel too. They actually spent time deliberately setting up a cycle game when Kessel wasn't there.

corksens
11-10-2014, 10:14 AM
the first two were stoppable.The first goal was a screened laser that went top corner. Sometimes you guys are absurd in your expectations. Most goalies aren't stopping that.

corksens
11-10-2014, 10:16 AM
see here's the thing on that play - most other dmen aren't even able to get to that puck in time. with most other dmen holland's probably in on a break.

the other factor is that your coach just played him near 30min in back to back games.I think we were talking about different goals - Johnny and I at least.

I'm referring to the cross crease pass one timer. Not the PP.

As zeke mentions, most other players don't get back on that puck. He should have been stronger on his stick though. He's too casual sometimes.

JohnnyHolmes
11-10-2014, 10:38 AM
I think we were talking about different goals - Johnny and I at least.

I'm referring to the cross crease pass one timer. Not the PP.

As zeke mentions, most other players don't get back on that puck. He should have been stronger on his stick though. He's too casual sometimes.

Yes I meant the shortie. Whoops.

Hoffman is for real. He's one of those guys that just finds the back of the net. Can't fault Reimer for that one, especially since Rielly basically handed the puck to a guy in the slot.

Metalleaf
11-10-2014, 10:51 AM
Scary thought but if Karlsson was a Leaf, pretty sure people would want him traded, because he doesn't play "defence" properly....

number17
11-10-2014, 10:55 AM
Scary thought but if Karlsson was a Leaf, pretty sure people would want him traded, because he doesn't play "defence" properly....Not when he puts up a PPG ... his lack of D becomes excusable then :)

But yes, the first time Karlsson's production dips below 50 points, the fans will want to boo him out of town.

All that said, seeing how Karlsson COULD actually catch up to Holland, but then completely miss both the player and the puck was funny on that shortie :)

zeke
11-10-2014, 10:56 AM
The first goal was a screened laser that went top corner. Sometimes you guys are absurd in your expectations. Most goalies aren't stopping that.

fair enough.

I do think polak played it poorly.

the second one shoulda been stopped though.

number17
11-10-2014, 11:05 AM
fair enough.

I do think polak played it poorly.

the second one shoulda been stopped though.I don't think 1st goal was 'soft', but is it stoppable? Yeah.

It was combination of Polak and our F's fault. We actually won the draw on that play, Rielly threw it to the point for outlet, but like SO MANY TIMES it's happened over the past few years (and we still can't fix ... ) the F is too far away from the play, and takes off before the pass is even there, so the pass gets cut off. Polak was hence caught in no man's land, and he's not close enough to block or deflect the shot, but served as a screen only. He'd have been better off if he just moves away and let Reimer see the shot.

BUT, all this happened within 2 sec's for Polak. Our F needs to be more aware at the point, and Rielly needs to make sure he does have a clear path to the point when he makes that pass.

Hoss
11-10-2014, 11:25 AM
I really hope when we get some health back that Randy finally trusts the fourth line and stops playing this game of playing them some games, and not playing them enough in others.

Give them some time to gel and to give the other lines a breather. Its called TRUST Randy.

Metalleaf
11-10-2014, 11:32 AM
Yeah, that's why Holland is seeing so much ice now. trust...Panik too.

Volcanologist
11-10-2014, 11:39 AM
41 shots against, and Ottawa is a pretty average offensive squad. We continue to be miserable in this category (currently 27th), and need good to great goaltending to have a chance to win.

the good news...other than Reimer bouncing back of course, our improved depth is resulting in a team that takes a lot more shots than last season(currently 9th).

LeafOfFaith
11-10-2014, 02:50 PM
I could probably live with it if we're getting roughly the same number of shots as the opposition since we have such good scoring.

But we're not. We're still outshot pretty badly generally.

Not sure if it can be a personnel thing since there's such turnover every year, so there's one other fat possibility.

zeke
11-10-2014, 03:04 PM
we were doing better in the shots against department but we seem to be falling back into bad habits.

First 10gms we gave up 31 shots per game. Not great, but decent.

Last 5gms we've given up 38 shots per game, and that's not even against teams that have been great in the shots department this year really.

Rumpleforeskin
11-10-2014, 03:53 PM
That's because teams come in knowing we give up a lot of shots, so they take a lot of shots #science

Deckie007
11-10-2014, 04:20 PM
I cannot argue with that logic.

hockeylover
11-10-2014, 04:27 PM
we were doing better in the shots against department but we seem to be falling back into bad habits.

First 10gms we gave up 31 shots per game. Not great, but decent.

Last 5gms we've given up 38 shots per game, and that's not even against teams that have been great in the shots department this year really.

Any chance we can do a full comparison for this year vs last year so far?

zeke
11-10-2014, 04:33 PM
give it another 5gms.

LeafGm
11-10-2014, 04:33 PM
Yeah, that's why Holland is seeing so much ice now. trust...Panik too.
Let's not pretend that Randy saw the light and decided of his own initiative to finally give Holland and Panik some real minutes and opportunities. With the players we have out of the lineup due to injury and suspension, he just literally has no other choice---the only other players available to him at the bottom of the lineup are even younger and more inexperienced than either of those guys (Carrick, Leivo), or have sucked their way out of the lineup (Frattin).

It's also telling that 29 year-old Trevor Smith stepped into the lineup and immediately got twice as much ice-time as his 21 and 22 year-old linemates on the fourth line. Part of that is the 3:34 of time on the PK that Smith got, I assume because Smith also kills penalties for the Marlies. Which makes me kind of curious whether or not Leivo or Carrick kill penalties for the Marlies as well.

Metalleaf
11-10-2014, 04:41 PM
Carrick did, Leivo isn't a PKer.

BeLeafer
11-10-2014, 05:02 PM
Let's not pretend that Randy saw the light and decided of his own initiative to finally give Holland and Panik some real minutes and opportunities. With the players we have out of the lineup due to injury and suspension, he just literally has no other choice---the only other players available to him at the bottom of the lineup are even younger and more inexperienced than either of those guys (Carrick, Leivo), or have sucked their way out of the lineup (Frattin).

The same thing happened with Reimer under Wilson/Burke. He only got a shot after there was literally no other choice available. At least a few of us (can't remember how many) knew he had serious NHL potential from the start of the year or earlier, but they gave every stiff the job until they were all injured and had no other option short of lacing up some pads themselves.

LeafOfFaith
11-10-2014, 05:25 PM
When Lupul and Booth and the other vets are back, rest assured, Randy will be back to running three lines out versus four again.

rated
11-10-2014, 05:30 PM
Randy will be back to running three lines out versus four again.

And no other coach (that im aware of) in the NHL does this. So frustrating.

Deckie007
11-10-2014, 05:31 PM
And no other coach (that im aware of) in the NHL does this. So frustrating.

If it's broke, don't fix it? Coaches shorten their benches at crunch time, but Randy seems to be completely inept in line management regardless of the quality of his lines.

zeke
11-10-2014, 07:28 PM
i hope that holland and panik's play up the lineup will make randy have second thoights about giving them goon minutes again.

of course, it's just as likely that their play just lets randy take out his kadri whip again and send naz down to five minutes a night just because.

LeafOfFaith
11-10-2014, 08:10 PM
How hard is it to find a guy who will play our best players most and still run out competent bottom lines and pairs to keep the top liners fresh?

How much ineptitude do we need to witness before a change is made?

Wayward DP
11-11-2014, 12:07 AM
I really don't like Randy reuniting the top line. They've played terrible defense and not produced a whole ton of offense, and Phil and Naz were showing some great chemisdri

Deckie007
11-11-2014, 12:11 AM
I really don't like Randy reuniting the top line. They've played terrible defense and not produced a whole ton of offense, and Phil and Naz were showing some great chemisdri

Philkarmonics?

BeLeafer
11-11-2014, 06:28 AM
Nazural fit.

Pronger84
11-11-2014, 09:20 AM
The same thing happened with Reimer under Wilson/Burke. He only got a shot after there was literally no other choice available. At least a few of us (can't remember how many) knew he had serious NHL potential from the start of the year or earlier, but they gave every stiff the job until they were all injured and had no other option short of lacing up some pads themselves.

Heh. Metal and I were at that game when Gus gave up 6 goals and riemer was brought in for the first time.. Riemer stopped the 1st shot and the crowd actually begin chanting his name.

corksens
11-11-2014, 11:50 AM
Think this is the least chirp filled GDT Sens/Leafs thread in history.

corksens
11-11-2014, 11:55 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPWMfphLAUI

Hope the beer pouring guy gets his face kicked in.

hockeylover
11-11-2014, 12:17 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPWMfphLAUI

Hope the beer pouring guy gets his face kicked in.

Meh, if I saw someone take a swing at my friend I'd probably do the same thing.

corksens
11-11-2014, 12:29 PM
Yea, cause you're a chick. That's a chick move.

If someone takes a swing at my buddy I either take one of my own or try and break it up. Leaning down three rows, pouring a drink then trying to run away is the absolute lamest move one can pull.

hockeylover
11-11-2014, 12:49 PM
Yea, cause you're a chick. That's a chick move.

If someone takes a swing at my buddy I either take one of my own or try and break it up. Leaning down three rows, pouring a drink then trying to run away is the absolute lamest move one can pull.

They all seem like drunk morons.

But not sure why anyone had to take a swing at anyone. You guys should be used to losing to us at home by now.

CTheBigPicture
11-11-2014, 01:11 PM
They all seem like drunk morons.

But not sure why anyone had to take a swing at anyone. You guys should be used to losing to us at home by now.

ZING. You asked for hit Corks


Think this is the least chirp filled GDT Sens/Leafs thread in history.

Leafin'
11-11-2014, 02:47 PM
Yea, cause you're a chick. That's a chick move.

If someone takes a swing at my buddy I either take one of my own or try and break it up. Leaning down three rows, pouring a drink then trying to run away is the absolute lamest move one can pull.

:worshippy:

CaptainBolduke
11-11-2014, 03:10 PM
Yea, cause you're a chick. That's a chick move.

If someone takes a swing at my buddy I either take one of my own or try and break it up. Leaning down three rows, pouring a drink then trying to run away is the absolute lamest move one can pull.

Chick move? Ban?