on a truly shit team that stat is useless
Tank Nation Redux 2018
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on a truly shit team that stat is useless
With enough context it can tell you part of a story.
Fyi how this debate generated from a comment I read that Jeff Petry has been outstanding 5 on 5 this year. I queried how is that possible if he is -23
OEL is a -41 on a brutal team . Put him in Pittsburgh those numbers will improve dramatically .
Team analytics are more important than singular numbers . They can tell much more about your flaws or skewed numbers to make an analysis .
If 31 was even barely average some nights those +- numbers would look better .
CaptainBolduke
Active member
This is why this stat is not reliable. Too many factors.
IMO Drouin and Galchenyuk aren't shitty players. Galchenyuk was always fine with this stat until his year.
Drouin struggled in this category last year, but we still decided that head a worth a 6 year deal.
IMO Drouin and Galchenyuk aren't shitty players. Galchenyuk was always fine with this stat until his year.
Drouin struggled in this category last year, but we still decided that head a worth a 6 year deal.
As usual Bolduke does not understand nuance. Being a big - does not make one a shitty player to use his word but it might mean you were bad 5 on 5i one season
wiseguy1
Well-known member
Our hero Plekanec has the final word on this.
https://hockey30.com/nouvelles/toma...iser-alex-galchenyuk-28-et-jonathan-drouin-27
AYOYE..
- Tomas Plekanec (+3) se permet de viser Alex Galchenyuk (-28) et Jonathan Drouin (-27).
Tu ne peux pas contrôler certains facteurs, comme les buts dans un filet désert ou les mauvais changements de trios qui te donnent un moins sans être fautifs sur un but. Il y a toutefois des signes. Quand il y a un gros écart entre les joueurs au sein d’une même équipe, ça donne une bonne illustration à savoir si tu fais les sacrifices nécessaires pour respecter le jeu d’équipe et le système.
- OUCH...
https://hockey30.com/nouvelles/toma...iser-alex-galchenyuk-28-et-jonathan-drouin-27
AYOYE..
- Tomas Plekanec (+3) se permet de viser Alex Galchenyuk (-28) et Jonathan Drouin (-27).
Tu ne peux pas contrôler certains facteurs, comme les buts dans un filet désert ou les mauvais changements de trios qui te donnent un moins sans être fautifs sur un but. Il y a toutefois des signes. Quand il y a un gros écart entre les joueurs au sein d’une même équipe, ça donne une bonne illustration à savoir si tu fais les sacrifices nécessaires pour respecter le jeu d’équipe et le système.
- OUCH...
GrandWazoo
Well-known member
He's right, I'm old school but I know how to interpret +/- within the context of a team. The discrepancy between Plekanec and the other two is quite telling, especially given that Plekanec usually draw the defensive assignments.
+/- like many other analytical stats tells part of the story regarding a player because hockey is a team sport in the end and you can’t control what the other 5 guys on the ice are doing but when you are -20 or so don’t try and convince me that you are not responsible for a portion of that stat.
Sure... but you can be the reason that it's not -30. Or the reason it's not only -10. Hence, the number is meaningless.
-30 or -10 are both bad....either way it simply tells me you are on the ice for quite a bit of goals against.
I understand what you mean however but most analytic stats can also have the same variables you are mentioning
Altair
Well-known member
NHL
1.TBL 118
2.VGK 115
3.BOS 115
4.NSH 114
5.WPG 109
6 WSH 105
7.DAL 103
8.STL 102
9.TOR 102
10.MIN 98
11.SJS 98
12.LAK 97
13.CGY 95
14.COL 94
15.NJD 94
16.PHI 94
17.PIT 94
18.ANA 94
19.CBJ 90
20.CAR 89
21.NYI 88
22.NYR 85
23.CHI 84
24.FLA 82
25.DET 79
26. MTL 76
27.EDM 76
28.VAN 72
29.OTT 71
30.BUF 63
31.ARZ 54
So we are drafting 1-3 or 6-9 as of right now.
Great time to be picking up points, lets draft 10th. Or higher.
1.TBL 118
2.VGK 115
3.BOS 115
4.NSH 114
5.WPG 109
6 WSH 105
7.DAL 103
8.STL 102
9.TOR 102
10.MIN 98
11.SJS 98
12.LAK 97
13.CGY 95
14.COL 94
15.NJD 94
16.PHI 94
17.PIT 94
18.ANA 94
19.CBJ 90
20.CAR 89
21.NYI 88
22.NYR 85
23.CHI 84
24.FLA 82
25.DET 79
26. MTL 76
27.EDM 76
28.VAN 72
29.OTT 71
30.BUF 63
31.ARZ 54
So we are drafting 1-3 or 6-9 as of right now.
Great time to be picking up points, lets draft 10th. Or higher.
wiseguy1
Well-known member
But they got a point.
Altair
Well-known member
They could have gotten two.
lecoqsportif
Well-known member
Yah, and now they have to count on Ottawa to win. Not good.
legoalie
LeAdminie
plus/minus is still used today by every coach in the NHL along with the players so it isn't useless; you use the stat to gauge lines and d-pairings, not individual performances; ie 27 line was plus -2 or plek line was plus 2; so when used right its a great tool, when used as an individual stat it misses.
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