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The ****ing Offseason Thread 2018

Grant McCagg is losing it over that list, as are a lot of other hockey pundits. I'd honestly rather have Matthews than McDavid. Yeah, I get that Connor has that extra speed shift and so on, but Matthews is built like a ****ing truck, and he's going to be so, so valuable in the trenches down the road. We honestly have close to the best centre depth in the league. Add Mark Stone next year on a bit of a discount...? Heh.
 
These pundits are going to either 1) be shocked at how much better Matthews is than Tavares when you see them playing on the same team or 2) claim that Tavares declined and that's why Matthews looks so good in comparison.

Some of the names being mentioned on twitter as more deserving than Matthews of being #4 overall are crazy.
 
Stamkos kinda shouldn't be ranked. They sure seem to love playing him on the wing whenever possible.

A better player than JT? Yeah. A better centre? probably, but again he actually has to play there for it to count.
 
because injury derailed him from what was going to be a 45 goal 85 point season, you can still quibble Matthews in the top 5 if you want...probably not after this season though.

But we definitely have two of the league's top 12 centremen. not sure how you could argue that.

people might be sleeping on Tavares a bit because the Isles have sucked.
 
KingTucker said:
Grant McCagg is losing it over that list, as are a lot of other hockey pundits. I'd honestly rather have Matthews than McDavid. Yeah, I get that Connor has that extra speed shift and so on, but Matthews is built like a ****ing truck, and he's going to be so, so valuable in the trenches down the road. We honestly have close to the best centre depth in the league. Add Mark Stone next year on a bit of a discount...? Heh.
Click to expand...
From what I've seen of McCagg, he's a deeply biased twitter troll who's sycophantic love of everything Bergevin & the Habs do is matched only by his obsessive hatred of anything related to the Leafs.

So his opinions on Auston Matthews are worth less than nothing.
 
last 2yrs centers in order of primary points per 60 at even strength (min 14esmpg), with quality of competition and xgf relative in brackets

1.Malkin 2.49p1/60 (B+ qoc, -0.2xgf)
2.McDavid 2.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +7.1xgf)
3.Matthews 2.34p1/60 (A- qoc, +2.2xgf)
4.Barzal 2.14p1/60 (B qoc, +5.9xgf)
5.Stamkos 2.10p1/60 (B+ qoc, +0.9xgf)
6.Scheifele 1.95p1/60 (A qoc, +3.6xgf)
7.MacKinnon 1.92p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.8xgf)
8.Crosby 1.87p1/60 (A+ qoc, +4.5xgf)
9.Drai 1.81p1/60 (A qoc, +2.8xgf)
10.Kuz 1.79p1/60 (B+ qoc, -0 4xgf)
11.Barkov 1.75p1/60 (A qoc, +4 0xgf)
12.Getzlaf 1.75p1/60 (A- qoc, +3.1xgf)
13.Staal 1.68p1/60 (B+ qoc, +1.5xgf)
14.Couts 1.66p1/60 (A qoc, +7.2xgf)
15.Eichel 1.58p1/60 (A- qoc, +2.1xgf)
16.Zetts 1.58p1/60 (B+ qoc, +7.0xgf)
17.Tavares 1.56p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.8xgf)
18.Horvat 1.56p1/60 (B qoc, +3.4xgf)
19.Seguin 1.55p1/60 (A qoc, -0.8xgf)
20.Point 1.55p1/60 (B+ qoc, +1.6xgf)
21.Krejci 1.54p1/60 (B qoc, -3.6xgf)
22.Duchene 1.53p1/60 (A- qoc, +1.8xgf)
23.Toews 1.52p1/60 (A+ qoc, +1.1xgf)
(Karlsson 1.51p1/60 (B qoc, +1.6xgf)) - less than 14esmpg
24.Kadri 1.51p1/60 (A qoc, -0.3xgf)
25.Backstrom 1.49p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.7xgf)
26.Kopitar 1.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +1.8xgf)
26.Bergeron 1.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +4.6xgf)

nice to finally have stats that correspond with the eye test .

we can quibble with the order but all 20 of these guys are top 26 on this p1/60 list.

imo they jumped the gun with Karlsson. he shouldn't be there. I'd probably also take out Seguin.

but the rest mostly make sense when you adjust for Qualcomp, possession....and also linemates, which I didn't try to include here (but obviously effect the rankings of guys like drai and tavares).
 
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zeke said:
last 2yrs centers in order of primary points per 60 at even strength (min 14esmpg), with quality of competition and xgf relative in brackets

1.Malkin 2.49p1/60 (B+ qoc, -0.2xgf)
2.McDavid 2.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +7.1xgf)
3.Matthews 2.34p1/60 (A- qoc, +2.2xgf)
4.Barzal 2.14p1/60 (B qoc, +5.9xgf)
5.Stamkos 2.10p1/60 (B+ qoc, +0.9xgf)
6.Scheifele 1.95p1/60 (A qoc, +3.6xgf)
7.MacKinnon 1.92p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.8xgf)
8.Crosby 1.87p1/60 (A+ qoc, +4.5xgf)
9.Drai 1.81p1/60 (A qoc, +2.8xgf)
10.Kuz 1.79p1/60 (B+ qoc, -0 4xgf)
11.Barkov 1.75p1/60 (A qoc, +4 0xgf)
12.Getzlaf 1.75p1/60 (A- qoc, +3.1xgf)
13.Staal 1.68p1/60 (B+ qoc, +1.5xgf)
14.Couts 1.66p1/60 (A qoc, +7.2xgf)
15.Eichel 1.58p1/60 (A- qoc, +2.1xgf)
16.Zetts 1.58p1/60 (B+ qoc, +7.0xgf)
17.Tavares 1.56p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.8xgf)
18.Horvat 1.56p1/60 (B qoc, +3.4xgf)
19.Seguin 1.55p1/60 (A qoc, -0.8xgf)
20.Point 1.55p1/60 (B+ qoc, +1.6xgf)
21.Krejci 1.54p1/60 (B qoc, -3.6xgf)
22.Duchene 1.53p1/60 (A- qoc, +1.8xgf)
23.Toews 1.52p1/60 (A+ qoc, +1.1xgf)
(Karlsson 1.51p1/60 (B qoc, +1.6xgf)) - less than 14esmpg
24.Kadri 1.51p1/60 (A qoc, -0.3xgf)
25.Backstrom 1.49p1/60 (A+ qoc, +2.7xgf)
26.Kopitar 1.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +1.8xgf)
26.Bergeron 1.43p1/60 (A+ qoc, +4.6xgf)

nice to finally have stats that correspond with the eye test .

we can quibble with the order but all 20 of these guys are top 26 on this p1/60 list.

imo they jumped the gun with Karlsson. he shouldn't be there. I'd probably also take out Seguin.

but the rest mostly make sense when you adjust for Qualcomp, possession....and also linemates, which I didn't try to include here (but obviously effect the rankings of guys like drai and tavares).
Click to expand...

You mean Seguin out of the list altogether?? That's crazy talk.

I take him over Horvat, Zetterberg, Staal, and everyone below him on your list, including Kopitar.
 
zeke said:
meh. borderline top 20 production, weak possession.
Click to expand...

Possession is the gayest thing in the world if it says Seguin isn't anything other than elite.

You want to quibble over who is more elite than whom, sure, whatever. But Seguin is a superstar.
 
btw I have always had this question ... why are QoC represented in 'grades'? I thought QoC was a number before (average of p/60 of the opponents a player plays against)
 
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