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Thread of Game of Thrones (spoilers inside)

The whole demanding surrender thing was just a giant shoe-horn so they could behead Missandei in a big dramatic stare down.

I mean, the show has a pretty well established history of demanding surrender/terms via raven, especially when there's a high level of risk to doing so in person and no chance of acceptance (see Robb). But no, we get this cringey bullshit scene where she marches herself, all her most important advisers, a good chunk of her forces, and her last god damn dragon into a slaughterhouse to demand a surrender that everyone knows Cersei will never accept...and the worst part is they don't even get killed for their stupidity.
 
I was telling a friend, if they wanted to do this, I’d rather the captured and beheaded character be someone more important.

She wasn’t exactly a key player to die in such a big way in the third to last episode.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
I was telling a friend, if they wanted to do this, I’d rather the captured and beheaded character be someone more important.

She wasn’t exactly a key player to die in such a big way in the third to last episode.
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I don't mind that, actually. This way, Dany has basically now lost her 2 oldest advisors, and it should set her up to be more reckless since she's really not sure she can trust anyone else at this point. While she's only been a minor character for the last couple seasons, she's important enough.

I mean, it's still sheer stupidity to trust Cersei at all, why they met in person there, and why Cersei didn't just start battering them down with arrows, makes for stupid plot points. But Tyrion really would have been the only "more important" character in that scene they could have done that with, and honestly, I don't think that would have had the same impact.
 
The surrender was devised as a way to potentially turn the commoners on Cersei, knowing that a battle was going to be a bloodbath of innocent bystanders.
 
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LeafGm said:
It was yet another example of the post-GRRM Tyrion being a complete moron. And it didn't really make sense either.
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It's weird what happened to Tyrion, he went from one of the most badass characters in TV history to a complete bumblepuss. When he stopped being a drunk, it was like when formerly great rock bands became lame when they stopped taking drugs.
 
LeafGm said:
It was yet another example of the post-GRRM Tyrion being a complete moron. And it didn't really make sense either.

With how much the show has nerfed the dragons, and with Daenerys & Cersei's remaining forces now about the same size---what possible reason would she ever have to surrender?
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Having superiors with the power of life and death, I can relate to Tyrion. He was asking for her to surrender for a simple reason. He did not want Dany to raze the capital to the ground.

When Dany is pissed and the imp and eunuch are trying to convince her that burning the capital would be a grave mistake. But with it being her decision at the end, and with her seeming hellbent on doing it, just convincing them to try something else before going on to do the worst possible thing is a success.

Its not a matter of Tyrion thinking it would work, more than Tyrion hoping against hope to prevent the bloodshed to come.
 
Altair said:
Having superiors with the power of life and death, I can relate to Tyrion. He was asking for her to surrender for a simple reason. He did not want Dany to raze the capital to the ground.

When Dany is pissed and the imp and eunuch are trying to convince her that burning the capital would be a grave mistake. But with it being her decision at the end, and with her seeming hellbent on doing it, just convincing them to try something else before going on to do the worst possible thing is a success.

Its not a matter of Tyrion thinking it would work, more than Tyrion hoping against hope to prevent the bloodshed to come.
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My only problem with that is, especially after Euron just killed one dragon, the fight is not really looking like a lopsided affair. I could see them requesting Cersei surrender if it was obvious they were going to win, but with it being an even battle, even the optics of this doesn't make sense. Yeah, it would have been a good thing to do before the whole battle up North, but now, not so much.

But I also understand that it was more of a hail mary effort. Dany wants the crown, and doesn't want to/can't wait for them to starve out the capital. Plotwise, it sets up even more reason to enrage Dany, but it made for a little bit of an awkward encounter.
 
UWHabs said:
My only problem with that is, especially after Euron just killed one dragon, the fight is not really looking like a lopsided affair. I could see them requesting Cersei surrender if it was obvious they were going to win, but with it being an even battle, even the optics of this doesn't make sense. Yeah, it would have been a good thing to do before the whole battle up North, but now, not so much.

But I also understand that it was more of a hail mary effort. Dany wants the crown, and doesn't want to/can't wait for them to starve out the capital. Plotwise, it sets up even more reason to enrage Dany, but it made for a little bit of an awkward encounter.
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Honestly it looked like Cersei has the upper hand. I thought maybe it was a diversion to sneak into King's Landing (Jamie/Arya/Clegane?). or some kind of sneak attack with troops. but meh
 
UWHabs said:
My only problem with that is, especially after Euron just killed one dragon, the fight is not really looking like a lopsided affair. I could see them requesting Cersei surrender if it was obvious they were going to win, but with it being an even battle, even the optics of this doesn't make sense. Yeah, it would have been a good thing to do before the whole battle up North, but now, not so much.

But I also understand that it was more of a hail mary effort. Dany wants the crown, and doesn't want to/can't wait for them to starve out the capital. Plotwise, it sets up even more reason to enrage Dany, but it made for a little bit of an awkward encounter.
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The choice dany wants/needs is either charge the capital and end things that day.

That ends in one of two ways.

A) Most likely outcome is Dany loses and loses hard. Dragon dead, unsullied dead, Dany dead or in exile, again. Tyrion wants to avoid that for obvious reasons

B) Less likely outcome, Dany wins. In the process she destroys kings landing, kills thousands, her forces likely weakened to the point of winning the peace being impossible. Begins her rule hated as much as cersei leading to multiple rebellions and brutal crackdowns. She becomes her father. Going mad and burning everyone. Not as bad as option A but still pretty ****ing bad.

Tyrion gets her to at least delay, to try a hail Mary he knows won't work, but anything is better than rushing into options A or B. Much better to put everything you have into the miniscule chance that options A and B can be avoided if that's all he can get.
 
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They basically acknowledged it would be a pointless exercise through Dany, who didn’t want to do it.

I’m not so put off by the logic of it. But I do think Cersei maybe should’ve attacked them in their vulnerable state. Having said that, I’m maybe even okay with that. Because then the story would always be that she slaughtered Dany’s forces when they came in peace. Not that Cersei has the rep of a benevolent ruler after blowing up the sept or whatever it’s calked, but still.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
They basically acknowledged it would be a pointless exercise through Dany, who didn’t want to do it.

I’m not so put off by the logic of it. But I do think Cersei maybe should’ve attacked them in their vulnerable state. Having said that, I’m maybe even okay with that. Because then the story would always be that she slaughtered Dany’s forces when they came in peace. Not that Cersei has the rep of a benevolent ruler after blowing up the sept or whatever it’s calked, but still.
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The story is whatever the victors say it is.

There are two ways that this scenario plays out.

The sane way, Tyrion goes to parley, Dany and her army well enough back, Drogon nowhere near those scorpions.

The way it did with Dany and her handful of unsullied a few hundred meters from the front gate with the drogon in his dragon parking spot.

The second one makes for more intimate visuals and emotional response to the beheading.

The first one makes for a more detached experience, although one rooted in logic.

GOT is going for style over substance this season, that much is clear. It's sad, because they were able to juggle both at one point.
 
GOT showrunners are tapped to write/produce the next Star Was trilogy - but not sure that would be getting in the way of completing GOT.
 
BG said:
GOT showrunners are tapped to write/produce the next Star Was trilogy - but not sure that would be getting in the way of completing GOT.
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star wars will be back to its roots..... jar jar binks
 
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