The Mother****ing Off Season Thread

the two softies cost us the series.

the PP differential let the bruins keep the series closer than it should have been.

zeke said:

the two softies cost us the series.

the PP differential let the bruins keep the series closer than it should have been.

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LOL no it didn't- This series never goes to 7 if the Leafs PK was even average, this should have been over in 5-6 games. Andersen was solid (2.75, .922%) all series, sure he let in 2 floaters, ones he should have had back,but by no means was that the deciding factor in the series either.

it was.

How are 2 bad goals in game 7 not a deciding factor in the series? You can talk about how the rest of the series went all you want, but what happens in game 7 is by definition, the deciding factor in the series. That's what game 7's are. One game that decides the series.

I do have some affection for Freddie. I mean, after a decade plus of the Leafs consistently getting some of the very worst goaltending in the league, Freddie's stepped in and consistently given us above-average goaltending during the regular season, and his teams have gotten into the playoffs in each of the three years he's been our starter.

But then he's sort of like Nazem Kadri, where as much as he's an important piece for us in the regular season and he's signed to a good contract, he keeps letting this team down in the playoffs.

And Freddie did let this team down in the playoffs this year and for the third year in a row too. I don't know how anyone could watch the highlights of game seven this year, game seven last year and some of the crucial moments in our series against Washington and not concede that he's let in goals that range from butter soft to laughable, and usually at the most inopportune moments.

So I honestly don't know what you even do with him. Against clearly inferior playoff opponents, Freddie would probably be good enough to get the Leafs through. But against truly good teams and in series where it's pretty much a coin flip who the better team is, Freddie is and likely will continue to be a difference-maker for all of the wrong reasons.

MindzEye said:

How are 2 bad goals in game 7 not a deciding factor in the series? You can talk about how the rest of the series went all you want, but what happens in game 7 is by definition, the deciding factor in the series. That's what game 7's are. One game that decides the series.

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The reason this series went to Game 7, was because we had brutal PK'ing, how anyone can't see that is beyond me. I never said anything about Game 7 not being the deciding game, I merely said I don't blame Andersen for the Leafs losing the series, its a lazy way out, and doesn't paint an accurate picture of what actually went down in the first round vs the bruins. Sure Andersen gives up some weak ones in Game 7, never said he didn't, something he needs to work on going forward if he firmly wants to edge himself into a top 3-5 NHL starting goalie, but I draw the line at saying the two floaters he let in were the reason we lost in the 1st round.

The reason this series went to Game 7

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I'm going to stop you there, because you're still clearly not reading before hitting the "quote" button.

Nobody is questioning why it went to game 7. Nobody is saying that the PK didn't suck fat dick. But when you get to a game 7, regardless of why you're in a game 7, by definition it is series defining. Whatever happened before game 7 no longer matters to deciding the series. In game 7, Freddy allowed 2 laughers that largely decided game 7 almost by themselves. Game 7 decided the series, and Freddy largely decided game 7.

and before this gets too silly. Freddy gave up two shit goals in game 6 as well. The Marchand goal off the faceoff (which was deflected, but went right through Fred) and the Krug goal after Freddy booted out a bad rebound and was slow getting over to the post.

Neither had the odor of either game 7 goal, but both were kind of shit as well. Two games in a row Freddy gave up bad goals timed almost perfectly to do the most damage to our chances of winning. Ugly tying and go ahead goals in game 6, truly grim 1st goal of the game in 7, and then another true laugher after the Leafs had cut it to 2-1.

3 yrs in a row, having significant negative impact on winning the most important games of the series.

Tough to blame a goalie for any goal that gets deflected from in close. It’s great if they stop it, but I can’t be upset if they don’t.

Also in seeing some of the goaltending during the playoffs, everyone should be seeing that nobody gets perfect goaltending and Freddy is held to too high a standard. I mean, just check out Martin Jones’s performance in the 5-0 loss. Terrible. That’s truly bad goaltending, and Freddy never came close to that.

Sure, I’d love it if he singlehandedly won us a game 7, but these guys have to be scoring on the other guy for us to win. Not going to win with only one goal in game 7, and to expect a shutout is asking a bit much. Leafs scored 5 goals in the last three games. That’s not a recipe for victory.

LeafOfFaith said:

Leafs scored 5 goals in the last three games. That’s not a recipe for victory.

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That's just it. Forget obsessing over goaltending for a second. Where the **** was the goal scoring? The Leafs forward group is the envy of the league. The offence is stacked with elite players -- one of them should have been able to make a difference in either game 6 or 7.

LeafOfFaith said:

Tough to blame a goalie for any goal that gets deflected from in close. It’s great if they stop it, but I can’t be upset if they don’t.

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Goalies stop tipped pucks all the time. It's not routine, but it's far from abnormal

Also in seeing some of the goaltending during the playoffs, everyone should be seeing that nobody gets perfect goaltending and Freddy is held to too high a standard. I mean, just check out Martin Jones’s performance in the 5-0 loss. Terrible. That’s truly bad goaltending, and Freddy never came close to that.

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The only standard being expected of him is to stop giving up terrible goals in big games, or to at least play the other guy even in those games. We had a chance to win the series in 6 and Freddy was the 2nd best goalie on the ice. We had a chance to win it game 7 and again, 2nd best goalie on the ice.

Sure, I’d love it if he singlehandedly won us a game 7, but these guys have to be scoring on the other guy for us to win. Not going to win with only one goal in game 7, and to expect a shutout is asking a bit much. Leafs scored 5 goals in the last three games. That’s not a recipe for victory.

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This is why the 1st goal in game 7 was such a big deal. When Boston has a lead, they're a flat out fantastic defensive team. Incredible defensive team with the lead. It's one thing entirely if your team gives up a legit chance and it ends up in the net, but you just can't be putting your team down 1 with a laugher against Boston if you expect to win. To win that game, the Leafs would have had to score 4 against an elite defensive team. Good luck. If Freddy makes the two stops he should have made, now you need 2. Completely different proposition.

CH1 said:

That's just it. Forget obsessing over goaltending for a second. Where the **** was the goal scoring? The Leafs forward group is the envy of the league. The offence is stacked with elite players -- one of them should have been able to make a difference in either game 6 or 7.

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PP died a painful death (which has been discussed a lot around here), Boston is about as good as anyone in the league at limiting chances, and Rask was very good. You have to be able to hold leads against them when you have one. If you're chasing the game, you have to keep it close because they're not prone to giving up goals in bunches. Boston is an excellent team, and you can't give them chances to put their foot on your neck. Our goaltending did that though, in the most important situations of the series. Put Boston in a position to play their preferred style of game.

Anderson didnt steal us a game.
Rask did.
Billington, rask, jones, bobo all stole games for their teams this playoffs.
Anderson did not.

Also, if you look back at Anderson's playoff game seven performances, he doesnt have a very good record.
Is this the result of his play or the play of the team or both?

I choose to believe that anderson has a problem in high stress situations like game 7s.
Ridiculous? Maybe. But the facts show that anderson isnt a dependable showdown type of goalie.

Without a doubt, anderson is the best goalie the leafs have had since belfore.
During the regular season, anderson was amazing for the leafs.
The problem is that if the leafs hang onto Anderson this season, and he shuts the bed in the playoffs AGAIN, his value will very low.
Sometimes, as many of you know, it might be in the best interests of the team to trade while his value is still very high.

Who can the leafs get to replace him? I dont know. But I do know that one more playoffs like the past 3, then his value to other team as well as the leafs, will be nil.

Anderson was directly responsible for 2 losses vs washington, the goal wilson scored against him was horrible.
Against the bruins, he has continued to let in weak goals.

Yes the pk and the pp were both inefficient and ineffective, but I think that was more to do with coaching then the players themselves.

Finally, I ask you all again (same as I did around last dec) why do the leafs even need a forth centerman?

If johnnyt and Matthew's each get their 21-22 minutes a game, and kadri gets his 17, the math shows there really is no minutes for a forth centerman. And to boot, nylander can always jump in to fill in as the forth when needed.
Use tavares and Matthew's on the damn PK you stupid twat babcock.

By the way ...... morning everyone lol

One of the biggest problems, imo, is that the front of our net isnt exactly a danger zone for opposing players.

True good point

I don't recall (m)any important goals being scored on tight rebounds or because Boston was owning the front of the net though. We have a much bigger problem between the half boards and the blueline than we do in front of our net.

MindzEye said:

I don't recall (m)any important goals being scored on tight rebounds or because Boston was owning the front of the net though. We have a much bigger problem between the half boards and the blueline than we do in front of our net.

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Agreed! I find we are very weak along the boards, and also concede the NZ far too easily, we just sit back and let the opposition walk right in and set up shop, this doesn't just apply to the Boston series, but to pretty much every team in general that we face. I'll say this got really exposed vs Boston however, and Boston's bread/butter is setting up the points and generating their offense down low, either by point shots or their cycle game, we struggle mightily against it.

I'm not sure if this is a player issue, a systematic one, or a combo of both, what I do know is going forward this has to be given major adjustments.

imo it's a combination of personnel and system. Babcock doesn't trust his defenders down low and collapses the shit out of the wingers to compensate, which leads to the wingers losing the race to the half boards more often than they should if they just covered their "zone". When they do win the race, a bunch of our wingers do a pretty poor job at winning the puck battles against the pinching defenders....and do defenders ever pinch the **** out of us, pretty clearly a coaching decision by our opposition.

MindzEye said:

imo it's a combination of personnel and system. Babcock doesn't trust his defenders down low and collapses the shit out of the wingers to compensate, which leads to the wingers losing the race to the half boards more often than they should if they just covered their "zone". When they do win the race, a bunch of our wingers do a pretty poor job at winning the puck battles against the pinching defenders....and do defenders ever pinch the **** out of us, pretty clearly a coaching decision by our opposition.

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You make a very good point about Babcock not trusting his players, I've noticed that as well, that he likes to "play it safe" too often, likely out a fear of losing, as opposed to taking some gambles at key points in a game. Our wingers are on the small side, and really outside of Hyman/Ennis/Moore, I really don't see the others engaged in wanting to win puck battles, even Marner who tries isn't good at board battles, we do lose a lot of the "one on one" puck battles out there.

What I wish Babcock would do, is instruct his players to use their speed to step up in the NZ, to put pressure on the puck carriers to make a mistake/turnover, and not allow easy entry to the d-zone. I get it the leafs aren't a physical team, and they suck ass at puck battles along the boards, but I think they can more than make up for that by using their blazing speed to put up road blocks for the opposition.

I'll be the first to say I can't stand the Bruins, but I will give them a ton of credit for being able to neuter the other teams by clogging up the NZ and prevent them from generating chances... if theres one thing I wish the leafs could learn from the Bruins it would be that.