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Leafs' Prospect/Marlies Discussion Thread!

Sure, but take away the gifted PP usage and we're talking about a long term contract a million less per and probably not 7 yrs. I don't blame the braintrust for thinking that they found a reliable RHD, I blame them for juicing his usage (back when half the world was asking why they weren't running a 4 forward set up like a lot of top PP's) and his contract comparables taking a big bump from the 20-25 point group to the 35-40 point RFA group.
 
I blame them for signing a guy who didn't deserve a 7 year deal for 7 years. Pure miss by management.

Dubas wouldn't have overpaid because of secondary assists on disappearing PP time.
 
leafman101 said:
I blame them for signing a guy who didn't deserve a 7 year deal for 7 years. Pure miss by management.

Dubas wouldn't have overpaid because of secondary assists on disappearing PP time.
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One look at Zaitsev's zone exit numbers in his rookie year would have been enough for dubas to fire Zaitsev out of a cannon. Not to mention the lack of primary points and clearly inflated point totals. Leafs paid for a 30-35+ point d. He's not that. He can't defend, he can't pass... There's not much he does well.
 
leafman101 said:
Disagree. There is lots of blame to be directed at management for signing him long term.
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You know that Babcock has(had?) a bunch more stroke when it comes to player personnel decisions than most coaches, eh?

For all intents and purposes, under Lou, Babcock was part of the "management" group.
 
That's just a convenient excused to shit on Babs for literally everything. Sure he has influence in the organization. But the GM is responsible for signing contracts. period. Putting Zaitsev's 7 year extension on the coach is nonsense.
 
If you think about it logically, Babs hasn't even been a huge Zaitsev supporter. He was filler on PP to avoid putting too much on Rielly's plate once he got top shutdown minutes and was immediately replaced when they felt Rielly was up to the challenge, and he was immediately replaced on the top pair when they signed Hainsey who isn't exactly a superstar.

The best you can say about Babs and Zaitsev, is he likes him better than Polak/Carrick/Corrado/Ozhiganov.
 
MindzEye said:
Sure, but take away the gifted PP usage and we're talking about a long term contract a million less per and probably not 7 yrs. I don't blame the braintrust for thinking that they found a reliable RHD, I blame them for juicing his usage (back when half the world was asking why they weren't running a 4 forward set up like a lot of top PP's) and his contract comparables taking a big bump from the 20-25 point group to the 35-40 point RFA group.
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at the same time, do we get Mo on his deal if he got PP time from the start?
 
leafman101 said:
If you think about it logically, Babs hasn't even been a huge Zaitsev supporter. He was filler on PP to avoid putting too much on Rielly's plate once he got top shutdown minutes and was immediately replaced when they felt Rielly was up to the challenge, and he was immediately replaced on the top pair when they signed Hainsey who isn't exactly a superstar.

The best you can say about Babs and Zaitsev, is he likes him better than Polak/Carrick/Corrado/Ozhiganov.
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eh, he's more than once called him "by far his best defensive dman".
 
yeah the Zaits contract is on Lou, not Babs.

I mean Carrick was in our top-four that year, I get playing Zaits the way Babs did. And, as zeke points out, it's not like he was totally drowning. Plus, as a rookie you expect some hiccups and growth. It just looks like there ain't much growin to be done.
 
I'll say this: Babs clearly likes Zaitsev a lot. He is untouchable in the top four and has never said anything but positive words about him.

But I can't blame him for Lou signing him to that deal. That's a reach for me. Just like I never really got on board with blaming Babs for the Leivo trade. Both moves are on the GM.. one was clearly far more catestrophic than the other, but regardless both are on the GM IMO. If Babs pushed hard for both moves, that doesn't matter. A GM should have balls and pick the players he wants for the team if he truly disagreed with Babs.
 
Zaitsev is literally the only guy on the team who gives opposing forwards some cause for concern in our zone. He is a dirty physical player who is good at flying under the radar and gets away with doling out a lot of abuse. He’s a good skater too. All this griping about his passing isn’t incorrect, but it is overblown. I think the biggest issue is his decision making under pressure, which I’d have faith improves over time. He’s still a young guy, only a few years into the league.

So to think that he has to go and is hurting us is silly. No doubt in my mind that as soon as the Leafs identify an opportunity to acquire a top guy like AP, they’ll have zero trouble trading Zaitsev in that deal, or in another deal and get actual value in return.

I frankly have a much bigger issue with Hainsey. I fear he’s going to hurt us in the playoffs, once he’s fully worn out.

Funny thing is, putting cap aside, Hainsey and Zaitsev would probably be a great bottom pair and PK specialists. If Mo, Jake, Dermott, and AP were our top 4, there’d be absolutely nothing to complain about. We’re one trade, and proper pairing placements, away from that.
 
Zaitsev has the tools to be decent if he would skate with the puck and stop throwing it away

Not sure if it’s a confidence thing or he is just not a good decision maker but he’s a fairly good skater
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Zaitsev is literally the only guy on the team who gives opposing forwards some cause for concern in our zone. He is a dirty physical player who is good at flying under the radar and gets away with doling out a lot of abuse. He’s a good skater too. All this griping about his passing isn’t incorrect, but it is overblown. I think the biggest issue is his decision making under pressure, which I’d have faith improves over time. He’s still a young guy, only a few years into the league.

So to think that he has to go and is hurting us is silly. No doubt in my mind that as soon as the Leafs identify an opportunity to acquire a top guy like AP, they’ll have zero trouble trading Zaitsev in that deal, or in another deal and get actual value in return.

I frankly have a much bigger issue with Hainsey. I fear he’s going to hurt us in the playoffs, once he’s fully worn out.

Funny thing is, putting cap aside, Hainsey and Zaitsev would probably be a great bottom pair and PK specialists. If Mo, Jake, Dermott, and AP were our top 4, there’d be absolutely nothing to complain about. We’re one trade, and proper pairing placements, away from that.
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Man...
 
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