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OT: American Politics

Altair said:
If America would rather go it alone on trade,diplomatically, and militarily, then I hope they suffer for that decision.

Because he isn't going to get a better deal on NAFTA, so he will probably just kill it if he can.

He isn't negotiating a better deal on Iran, and Europe and China refuse to follow along.

The Paris deal will continue on in some way shape or form without the only country in the world who refused to go along with it.

TPP will continue along, and ironically, open up the Canadian dairy market that Trump continues to go on about.

NATO, good luck America, will all your foreign adventures without assistance.

G7 will be the G6, and america will be shut out of the west global policy makers and the agenda they set.

America isn't renegotiating anything right now, it's tearing everything up in a fit of nonsense
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It really chaps your ass that NATO, NAFTA and G7 countries need the USA more than the USA needs them doesn’t it?

Sure it benefits all when there is a strong relationship but ultimately, the other countries need the USA more. Trump is exploiting that and it pisses people off. Recognize already.
 
Habsy said:
I know it’s hard for you to accept you’re employed in a feckless military. Especially when you have to realize you’re up shits creek without protection.

Maybe you should pay for that protection no?
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I will always call for Canada to invest in its military, always have, always will.

And I supported trumps original stance on the matter, which rattled everyone enough to the point of action, Canada included.

But this goes way too far. This is going to kill NATO itself. He's throwing the baby out with the bathwater here, and no, I'm not going to stand by and say everything is going to be okay, and NATO is going to be fine.

This is a monumental, colossal strategic mistake on the part of the USA, and will destroy the foundations of the alliance itself. NATO has kept the peace far more than any trade deal, or G7, or America-Russia summits. NATO has guaranteed the safety of everyone in it, the USA included, unless you want to forget that the only time article 5 of NATO has been triggered was after 9-11, and that countless soldiers not from the USA, died or were wounded in war in solidarity with American in her time of need.

All that is going to shit. NATO also had the added benefit of keeping conflicting military goals and strategies pointing in largely the same way. With NATO dead, and it is dying, nothing is to stop the EU and their military organizational working outside of US interests, even directly opposed to it. In a few years when they fully integrate out of necessity in a post USA defense posture, Europe will not be playing friendly with the USA.

There is a massive strategic shift in the making, because President dum dum can't look future into the future than the midterms and how tough he looks.

As for me, I see exactly where Canada is going to go with this. Once trump kills NORAD, we will be taking the Sweden route in military and international affairs.

We will up our spending, and the USA will see no benefit of it. We will work more closely with EII than the USA. We will be using our forces in UN missions and helping out select allies like Britain or France.

America will truly go it alone, and be worst off for it.
 
Habsy said:
It really chaps your ass that NATO, NAFTA and G7 countries need the USA more than the USA needs them doesn’t it?

Sure it benefits all when there is a strong relationship but ultimately, the other countries need the USA more. Trump is exploiting that and it pisses people off. Recognize already.
Click to expand...

this is the opposite of true, unfortunately.

there is no country in the world who benefits more from the current world order than the USA, and no country that would be hurt more by a significant change in that world order.
 
Altair said:
I will always call for Canada to invest in its military, always have, always will.

And I supported trumps original stance on the matter, which rattled everyone enough to the point of action, Canada included.

But this goes way too far. This is going to kill NATO itself. He's throwing the baby out with the bathwater here, and no, I'm not going to stand by and say everything is going to be okay, and NATO is going to be fine.

This is a monumental, colossal strategic mistake on the part of the USA, and will destroy the foundations of the alliance itself. NATO has kept the peace far more than any trade deal, or G7, or America-Russia summits. NATO has guaranteed the safety of everyone in it, the USA included, unless you want to forget that the only time article 5 of NATO has been triggered was after 9-11, and that countless soldiers not from the USA, died or were wounded in war in solidarity with American in her time of need.

All that is going to shit. NATO also had the added benefit of keeping conflicting military goals and strategies pointing in largely the same way. With NATO dead, and it is dying, nothing is to stop the EU and their military organizational working outside of US interests, even directly opposed to it. In a few years when they fully integrate out of necessity in a post USA defense posture, Europe will not be playing friendly with the USA.

There is a massive strategic shift in the making, because President dum dum can't look future into the future than the midterms and how tough he looks.

As for me, I see exactly where Canada is going to go with this. Once trump kills NORAD, we will be taking the Sweden route in military and international affairs.

We will up our spending, and the USA will see no benefit of it. We will work more closely with EII than the USA. We will be using our forces in UN missions and helping out select allies like Britain or France.

America will truly go it alone, and be worst off for it.
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**** that. Some NATO countries need to step up their own spending. They need to stop being a charity.

Also, the USA hands out more in foreign aid than anyone. It’s not even close. NATO countries will eventually comply.


I also find it ironic that nobody chastised Obama when he said many NATO countries need to up their defense spending. Curious.
 
zeke said:
this is the opposite of true, unfortunately.

there is no country in the world who benefits more from the current world order than the USA, and no country that would be hurt more by a significant change in that world order.
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And no other country in the world that spends more outside its borders for the benefit of others.
 
Habsy said:
**** that. Some NATO countries need to step up their own spending. They need to stop being a charity.
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NATO countries are, by in large spending more. It matters little to your president. NATO spending has been on the rise for years, mission accomplished? No, instead it's forget the 2024 deadline, DO IT NOW! Instead of 2 percent of GDP, it's now 4! America doesn't care, they are making a great show about how they pretend to, but it's clear as day they want out.
Also, the USA hands out more in foreign aid than anyone. It’s not even close. NATO countries will eventually comply.
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You think the USA is handing out foreign aid to NATO members? Get out. You're nuts. Also, just so you know, it is close.

US spends 31 billion on aid.

UK spends 18 billion

Germany spends 17 billion

So right there, the next two on the list spend more combined than the USA. So get out of here with that nonsense.

Japan, 10 billion

France 9 billion

Sweden 7 billion

Canada 4 billion

Norway 4 billion

Italy 4 billion

Seriously, how Americans still believe that nonsense that they spend more on foreign aid than anyone else is beyond me, I hope to god you're just trolling.
I also find it ironic that nobody chastised Obama when he said many NATO countries need to up their defense spending. Curious.
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And I didn't chastise trump when he said that NATO needed to spend more on their collective defense. But to start the road of leaving the alliance over it, that's just plain stupid and short sighted. Nobody should be okay with that.
 
You do realize you just proved that the USA is spending more on foreign aid than anyone else. This is just stupid. To say it’s incorrect is beyond dumb. Well done.

Your attempt at combining everything is laughable.
 
Habsy said:
You do realize you just proved that the USA is spending more on foreign aid than anyone else. This is just stupid. To say it’s incorrect is beyond dumb. Well done.

Your attempt at combining everything is laughable.
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Lets put it this way.

The Europe spends 91 billion dollars on foreign aid. what the US spends on foreign aid is paltry in comparison.

Speaking of foreign aid, there is a UN goal to reach 0.7 percent of national income on overseas aid. The US doesn't even come close to reaching it. United States works out at just 0.19 per cent of its national income.

Pay your bills.
 
Vox @voxdotcom
2m
Mueller just indicted 12 Russian intelligence officers for hacking and leaking Democratic emails vox.com/2018/7/13/1756…

Zoe Tillman
@ZoeTillman
NEW: Here is the indictment charging 12 members of Russian intelligence with hacking into the DCCC, DNC, and Hillary Clinton's campaign and releasing documents with the intent of interfering with the 2016 election justice.gov/file/1080281/d…

1:16pm · 13 Jul 2018 · TweetD
 
Altair said:
NATO countries are, by in large spending more. It matters little to your president. NATO spending has been on the rise for years, mission accomplished? No, instead it's forget the 2024 deadline, DO IT NOW! Instead of 2 percent of GDP, it's now 4! America doesn't care, they are making a great show about how they pretend to, but it's clear as day they want out. You think the USA is handing out foreign aid to NATO members? Get out. You're nuts. Also, just so you know, it is close.

US spends 31 billion on aid.

UK spends 18 billion

Germany spends 17 billion

So right there, the next two on the list spend more combined than the USA. So get out of here with that nonsense.

Japan, 10 billion

France 9 billion

Sweden 7 billion

Canada 4 billion

Norway 4 billion

Italy 4 billion

Seriously, how Americans still believe that nonsense that they spend more on foreign aid than anyone else is beyond me, I hope to god you're just trolling.

And I didn't chastise trump when he said that NATO needed to spend more on their collective defense. But to start the road of leaving the alliance over it, that's just plain stupid and short sighted. Nobody should be okay with that.
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where are those numbers from?

those are just the raw numbers....anything on per GDP?
 
Benjy Sarlin @BenjySarlin
27s
. @KenDilanianNBC notes indictment alleges Russia "on or about July 27, 2016" started trying to access Clinton's personal emails. Which is the same day Trump gave his "Russia if you're listening, I hope your able to find the 30,000 emails..." news conference.
 
the wrong sentences are highlighted here, but still:

Dh__weAWAAAzwMq.jpg:large
 
Follow the money


http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-toronto-tower-financing-linked-to-russia-2018-7

LONDON — A Financial Times investigation into the financing of President Donald Trump's Toronto hotel tower has found fresh evidence suggesting links between the US President and Russia.

The FT claims it has seen documents suggesting that the Kremlin may have been involved in indirectly financing the project. There is no suggestion that Trump knew.

The Trump International Hotel and Tower Toronto was financed by Russian-Canadian businessman Alex Shnaider. The FT said it has seen documents showing that Shnaider paid a $100 million "commission" to middlemen representing Kremlin interests who helped facilitate the sale of Shnaider's stake in a Ukrainian steel mill. The sale of the stake for $850 million was financed by Russian bank VEB, which was chaired by Vladimir Putin at the time.

The FT said that some of the money from the sale may have been used to help finance the construction of Trump Toronto. Shnaider earmarked $40 million for the project shortly after the sale.
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worm said:
where are those numbers from?

those are just the raw numbers....anything on per GDP?
Click to expand...

http://www.oecd.org/dac/stats/ODA-2015-detailed-summary.pdf

in terms of GNI

Sweden 1.36

Norway 1.14

Denmark 0.9

Netherlands .76

Switzerland .68

UK .67

Luxemburg .61

Findland 0.55

EU .5

Germany .49

France .36

Austria .31

Australia .26

Canada .25

Ireland .22

Iceland .22

japan .21

Italy .21

NZ .2

America .15(most recent reports have it at .19)

So america can shut its mouth.
 
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