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OT: World Politics

At least one thing was made crystal clear in this election -- liberals and centrists have such a deep hatred of the left and the working class that they would rather have an openly racist right wing extremist in power.

The same thing happened in 2016 in the dem primary. Clinton was never a good candidate for president but they'd cheat, lie and subvert democracy to prevent Sanders from winning the nomination. That's what gave us Donald Trump. And you can bet your bottom dollar that they will do this again in 2020. If Sanders wins the nomination, he will get the Corbyn treatment. Right now they're just trying to erase him, but when he starts winning states, the smears will come out in force.
 
It was the wildly arrogant Bernie Bros who helped get Trump elected. They were and still are the junior group in the D tent and need to learn to pick their battles with a modicum of strategic nous.

Instead, they placed delusional vapours over the obvious pragmatism of blocking an obviously odious wanna-be authoritarian whose base are racist evangelicals, and voila. Now the oh-so-clever Bros have the luxury of carping uselessly from the side lines, lavishing in pointless virtue signalling without the burden of actually trying to get anything done. As always...
 
Of course, neolibs spending all their time in their vast echo chambers would be completely unaware of the valid arguments against those delusions.

static.currentaffairs.org

Unless the Democrats Run Sanders, A Trump Nomination Means a Trump Presidency | Current Affairs

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This campaigning style makes Hillary Clinton Donald Trump’s dream opponent. She gives him an endless amount to work with. The emails, Benghazi, Whitewater, Iraq, the Lewinsky scandal, Chinagate, Travelgate, the missing law firm records, Jeffrey Epstein, Kissinger, Marc Rich, Haiti, Clinton Foundation tax errors, Clinton Foundation conflicts of interest, “We were broke when we left the White House,” Goldman Sachs… There is enough material in Hillary Clinton’s background for Donald Trump to run with six times over.

The defense offered by Clinton supporters is that none of these issues actually amount to anything once you look at them carefully. But this is completely irrelevant; all that matters is the fodder they would provide for the Trump machine. Who is going to be looking carefully? In the time you spend trying to clear up the basic facts of Whitewater, Trump will have made five more allegations.
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MindzEye said:
Yeah, already talk out of Scotland about Sturgeon writing BoJo asap to "request" the power to hold an independence referendum. BoJo is expected to decline it, setting off something of a constitutional crisis.
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That's going to get ugly, and Johnson has a potential issue on his hands in Northern Ireland as well since the Unionists are in the minority of their representation at Westminster for the first time ever. He's going to fight it, but this election set up a future where the UK leaves Europe but loses both Scotland and Northern Ireland in the process. Of course, that would take a long run of election results over time and the UK hasn't exactly been on a steady course over the past couple of decades.
 
lecoqsportif said:
It was the wildly arrogant Bernie Bros who helped get Trump elected. They were and still are the junior group in the D tent and need to learn to pick their battles with a modicum of strategic nous.

Instead, they placed delusional vapours over the obvious pragmatism of blocking an obviously odious wanna-be authoritarian whose base are racist evangelicals, and voila. Now the oh-so-clever Bros have the luxury of carping uselessly from the side lines, lavishing in pointless virtue signalling without the burden of actually trying to get anything done. As always...
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It's pretty familiar stuff. I remember plenty of the same BS floating around in the lead-up to the 2000 Presidential election about how Bush and Gore were exactly the same and it didn't matter who you voted for.

Some people would rather watch the world burn than compromise their ideological purity.

Though I suppose if your hope and dream is some kind massive restructuring of our society based on socialist principles, there's a certain logic to wanting things to get as bad as possible under the current system, rather than seeking compromise or working towards incremental improvements.
 
jeffbear said:
That's going to get ugly, and Johnson has a potential issue on his hands in Northern Ireland as well since the Unionists are in the minority of their representation at Westminster for the first time ever. He's going to fight it, but this election set up a future where the UK leaves Europe but loses both Scotland and Northern Ireland in the process. Of course, that would take a long run of election results over time and the UK hasn't exactly been on a steady course over the past couple of decades.
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Let us see how the next Scottish Election goes if Nicola makes it a election about seperation.

Having Scotland go SNP in a national election is one thing, having it go SNP in regional elections is another thing entirely. Kind of like in Canada, when the Bloc does will nationally but the PQ isn't in power in Quebec city.
 
So I don't really follow British politics so I have to ask those that do...

Why is Johnson winning a large majority that big a deal?
 
Habsy said:
So I don't really follow British politics so I have to ask those that do...

Why is Johnson winning a large majority that big a deal?
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Let's see.

David Cameron had a majority when he called for the brexit referendum. The UK voted to leave, he resigned.

Theresa May takes over the party. She wanted a new mandate in order to negotiate a brexit deal. She personally wasn't a brexit supporter and a lot of her conservative colleagues weren't as well, so she wasn't sure she would have enough support to get a deal passed. She runs a disasterous campaign, loses her majority. Has to rely on a minor party to have enough votes to govern. She tries time after time to get a brexit deal, but the opposition votes against her deal along with her fellow conservatives, including a bloc lead by Boris Johnson who think her deal doesn't break away from the EU enough. She delays brexit tine after time trying to get a new deal or find the votes she needs, but the EU won't renegotiate and she doesnt have the votes. Eventually she gives up and resigns.

Boris takes over, renegotiates a new deal with the EU, says he is willing to crash out of the EU with no deal in order to get it done. The opposition gangs up with a bunch of remain conservatives to force him to ask for an extension. He kicks those who voted against him out of the conservative party, meaning the minority he inherited from Theresa May got even smaller. He gets a new deal with the EU, but it fails to pass parliament every time. He is legally forced to ask the EU for an extension. Eventually he gets the election he wants, and wipes the floor with the Labour party, his main opposition. He now has a big majority and he has replaced all the anti brexit conservatives he has kicked out with loyal brexit supporters. There is now nothing in his way from getting the votes he needs for his brexit deal and brexit should be done by the end of January 2020.
 
Altair said:
Let's see.

David Cameron had a majority when he called for the brexit referendum. The UK voted to leave, he resigned.

Theresa May takes over the party. She wanted a new mandate in order to negotiate a brexit deal. She personally wasn't a brexit supporter and a lot of her conservative colleagues weren't as well, so she wasn't sure she would have enough support to get a deal passed. She runs a disasterous campaign, loses her majority. Has to rely on a minor party to have enough votes to govern. She tries time after time to get a brexit deal, but the opposition votes against her deal along with her fellow conservatives, including a bloc lead by Boris Johnson who think her deal doesn't break away from the EU enough. She delays brexit tine after time trying to get a new deal or find the votes she needs, but the EU won't renegotiate and she doesnt have the votes. Eventually she gives up and resigns.

Boris takes over, renegotiates a new deal with the EU, says he is willing to crash out of the EU with no deal in order to get it done. The opposition gangs up with a bunch of remain conservatives to force him to ask for an extension. He kicks those who voted against him out of the conservative party, meaning the minority he inherited from Theresa May got even smaller. He gets a new deal with the EU, but it fails to pass parliament every time. He is legally forced to ask the EU for an extension. Eventually he gets the election he wants, and wipes the floor with the Labour party, his main opposition. He now has a big majority and he has replaced all the anti brexit conservatives he has kicked out with loyal brexit supporters. There is now nothing in his way from getting the votes he needs for his brexit deal and brexit should be done by the end of January 2020.
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He can do that? Simply kick out dissenting conservatives from his own party?
 
Habsy said:
He can do that? Simply kick out dissenting conservatives from his own party?
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Yes. Party leaders in the westminister system have the power to kick people out of the caucus. Trudeau did it here in Canada to Jody Wilson Reybould for not shutting her trap about a scandal that was hurting the liberal party.

By that same token, if the caucus turns on the leader and the leader loses confidence of his party he is out of a job as well.
 
Altair said:
Let us see how the next Scottish Election goes if Nicola makes it a election about seperation.

Having Scotland go SNP in a national election is one thing, having it go SNP in regional elections is another thing entirely. Kind of like in Canada, when the Bloc does will nationally but the PQ isn't in power in Quebec city.
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I think she's going to do just that, but you're right to be skeptical ... at least in the short run. I just see the groundwork in place in both countries for the first time in awhile. Brexit would actually make Scottish independence more complicated, even if it would gain broader support by adding the Remainers to the hardcore Scottish nationalists.
 
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