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OT: American Politics

Wayward DP said:
yep, this follows a long line of Columbia students protesting against civilian deaths in armed conflicts or other alleged ethnic cleansing campaigns.

for example, in just the past couple of years, we have seen Columbia students gather and form similar encampments, replete with pro-terrorist messaging, to protest against the Syrian civil war (way more dead Muslims than in Gaza); the ongoing Sudanese conflict (and potential genocide in Darfur); the persecution of Rohingyas; the persecution of Uighurs.

oh, shit, nevermind. it was only the Jews that they felt the need to start an encampment for. wonder why that is...
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Ah yes famously there have never been any protests about wars in the middle east, ever.
 
Pwner said:
Personally, I think people are just responding to the lefts hypocrisy.

From 2017: When Is Speech Violence?



From June 2023: ‘Your speech is violence’: the left’s new mantra to justify campus violence



So what is it? Is speech violence or not, and if it is, then these protests ARE violence and should be shut down.
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I am just glad the right has now gone on record so clearly that yes, protestors can and should be arrested, and that yes, free speech has clear limits and threats of violence are no bueno.

They were singing quite a different tune just a couple years ago.
 
zeke said:
Of course not. And anyone who is violent or threatens violence should be arrested (and have been). But for the record there hasn't actually been any violence.
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there have been multiple reports (and some videos) of assaults, although I'm not sure any charges have been brought
 
zeke said:
I am just glad the right has now gone on record so clearly that yes, protestors can and should be arrested, and that yes, free speech has clear limits and threats of violence are no bueno.

They were singing quite a different tune just a couple years ago.
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Absolutely right, both sides have switched positions on this, which is interesting.....
 
zeke said:
Ah yes famously there have never been any protests about wars in the middle east, ever.
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I accept your choice to respond glibly rather than engage with the point I was actually making (that I am confident you understand).

but again, where was the Syrian solidarity encampment (legit asking in case I just missed it)? a lot more innocent civilians have died in Syria in the past decade than Gaza. at the hands of chemical weapons no less. and Syria is in the middle east!
 
Wayward DP said:
I accept your choice to respond glibly rather than engage with the point I was actually making (that I am confident you understand).

but again, where was the Syrian solidarity encampment (legit asking in case I just missed it)? a lot more innocent civilians have died in Syria in the past decade than Gaza. at the hands of chemical weapons no less. and Syria is in the middle east!
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Syria is a civil war afaik. Not sure what the protest would be about.

I think it's probably a good idea to be real about what Bibi and his ilk want here - they want all palestianians out. They don't want a two state solution and they can't let palestinians be full israelis because then they lose the country. And they've hardly been careful in their actions so far.
 
Wayward DP said:
there have been multiple reports (and some videos) of assaults, although I'm not sure any charges have been brought
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Watch out who is making thise reports. There does seem to have been some angry group yelling (which i believe has led to arrests) but i don't think there's been any actual violence yet.

I think there is one student that got poked in the eye by a flag but it doesnt seem to have been an actual attempt to injure.
 
lecoqsportif said:
Don’t be silly. Their (right wing) free speech is OK. But not for these people.
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But it was "these people" that were saying that right wing speech was not OK. But their speech is OK. That is what I am frustrated about.

And btw, I think each side should be allowed to argue with each other and that hurt feelings should be allowed. As long as no one is advocating for violence.
 
zeke said:
Syria is a civil war afaik. Not sure what the protest would be about.
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free Syria from Assad, duh. and what is the current protest even about?

hell, were there any protests for Ukraine?
zeke said:
I think it's probably a good idea to be real about what Bibi and his ilk want here - they want all palestianians out. They don't want a two state solution and they can't let palestinians be full israelis because then they lose the country. And they've hardly been careful in their actions so far.
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I am well aware and I despise Bibi and think he is one of the biggest threats to the future of Israel as a democratic and Jewish state. and I have serious problems with the conduct of the current conflict. but screaming about burning Tel Aviv to the ground and chanting pro-Hamas slogans isn't anti-Bibi or anti-war, it's the opposite.

and antagonizing and harassing Jewish students for being Jewish or Israeli is just antisemitism.
 
zeke said:
Watch out who is making thise reports. There does seem to have been some angry group yelling (which i believe has led to arrests) but i don't think there's been any actual violence yet.

I think there is one student that got poked in the eye by a flag but it doesnt seem to have been an actual attempt to injure.
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even accepting this as true, I still think this misses the point.

the effect (and I would argue, intention) of these gatherings has been to drive Jews and Israelis from university campuses. in many cases deliberately. I'm not okay with that and pretty upset by anyone who is.

if things keep up as they have, violence is inevitable.
 
zeke said:
But in reality, the vast majority of the "left" is perfectly ok with these protestors being arrested if they are actually blocking services, or are violent or threatening violence.

The hypocrisy is on the right.
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Safe spaces, microagressions, speech is violence, white silence is violence, trigger warnings. These are all leftist terms. They blocked (admittedly) problematic speakers from appearing on campus because students felt "unsafe".

But now, when another minority is saying these things (using their language), it is not taken as seriously, hmmmmm.....

And I did agree with most of these things,
 
Pwner said:
Safe spaces, microagressions, speech is violence, white silence is violence, trigger warnings. These are all leftist terms. They blocked (admittedly) problematic speakers from appearing on campus because students felt "unsafe".

But now, when another minority is saying these things (using their language), it is not taken as seriously, hmmmmm.....

And I did agree with most of these things,
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again, the vast majority of the left would support arresting protestors for threats of violence and the like.
 
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