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BOOK REVIEW: Burke' Law: A Life in Hockey

Deckie007 said:
Yeah, maybe the Habs aren't but the Leafs sure are. Shame you can't see anything except your narrow prospective.
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You are precisely the type of fan who allows this to continue. You are willfully blind to the fact that Leafs ownership and management only care about money. You want to believe that they care about winning so you do and they are happy to let you go on thinking that while you shovel money toward them.
 
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou said:
You are precisely the type of fan who allows this to continue. You are willfully blind to the fact that Leafs ownership and management only care about money. You want to believe that they care about winning so you do and they are happy to let you go on thinking that while you shovel money toward them.
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what evidence do you have to support your assertion that MLSE cares only about money and not at all about winning?
 
MLSE certainly wouldn't let the Leafs buy-out players, or take on dead-money contracts if what you are saying is true.

I'd have more trouble with a team that called itself competitive but didn't regularly spend to the cap.
 
The Leafs:

- Spend to the cap every year, even non competitive years (often taking on bad salary from elsewhere to provide competitive advantage through accrual of draft picks in the future)
- Have spent 10's of millions to bury bad contracts when necessary including flipping Clarkson's insured contract for Horton's uninsured contract, just to provide the club with competitive advtantage.
- Are well known to pay key non senior management figures what senior management figures make elsewhere so that they can retain who they deem to be top management talent (Pridham, etc)
- Literally run a "fuck the cost" operation with players everywhere they can without running afoul of the CBA police. World class facilities and services at every turn, extremely well documented
- Paid a lot of money for Mike Babcock, and then a lot of money for him to go away


This fucking guy is stuck in the Ballard or Stavros era in his head.
 
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou said:
You are precisely the type of fan who allows this to continue. You are willfully blind to the fact that Leafs ownership and management only care about money. You want to believe that they care about winning so you do and they are happy to let you go on thinking that while you shovel money toward them.
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If Leafs win the cup the cap is going sky high from MLSE profits. They make obscene money for every playoff game.

Inagine what MLSE made from the 2019 Raptors title in T-Shirts alone?
 
Like I said, he loses all perspective as soon as the discussion turned to the Leafs. Much like Frenemy, and makes the same arguments.

Tavares is a terrible player who actually makes you lose playoffs series, so addition by subtraction, is so absurd I don't even know what to say.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Like I said, he loses all perspective as soon as the discussion turned to the Leafs. Much like Frenemy, and makes the same arguments.

Tavares is a terrible player who actually makes you lose playoffs series, so addition by subtraction, is so absurd I don't even know what to say.
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In fairness I've never seen anyone hate anything like he hates the leafs. It's frightening tbh. Impossible to expect him to be objective when his head is on another planet when it comes to the leafs. The anti zeke.
 
Preston said:
In fairness I've never seen anyone hate anything like he hates the leafs. It's frightening tbh. Impossible to expect him to be objective when his head is on another planet when it comes to the leafs. The anti zeke.
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Like I said, Frenemy says the same shit - literally the exact same stuff. And it's so annoying because I almost don't think it's possible he can think it and is just trolling me, but he ACTUALLY THINKS IT. He actually thinks NYI is better without Tavares than with, and the proof is in the pudding because they suddenly had a playoff run. Tavares being there would've prevented that, and had his negative impact not been enough to keep them out, it would've toasted them in the first round just like it does to us. Worst captain in the league.

That's basically the summary.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Like I said, Frenemy says the same shit - literally the exact same stuff. And it's so annoying because I almost don't think it's possible he can think it and is just trolling me, but he ACTUALLY THINKS IT. He actually thinks NYI is better without Tavares than with, and the proof is in the pudding because they suddenly had a playoff run. Tavares being there would've prevented that, and had his negative impact not been enough to keep them out, it would've toasted them in the first round just like it does to us. Worst captain in the league.

That's basically the summary.
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Oh adorable hate-filled habsfans
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Like I said, Frenemy says the same shit - literally the exact same stuff. And it's so annoying because I almost don't think it's possible he can think it and is just trolling me, but he ACTUALLY THINKS IT. He actually thinks NYI is better without Tavares than with, and the proof is in the pudding because they suddenly had a playoff run. Tavares being there would've prevented that, and had his negative impact not been enough to keep them out, it would've toasted them in the first round just like it does to us. Worst captain in the league.

That's basically the summary.
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If there's enough emotion there you can convince yourself of anything. We've seen it here for a very long time from some of our own.

I will admit this dude is on another level tho. And it's because his hatred is INTENSE.
 
Yeah, that's a rational take. I have no reason to want to hate Succession. I'm invested through 30 episodes, if anything I want it to suddenly become good. But they've created a show with absolutely zero characters you want to root for (even the hokey bumpkin Greg the Egg is a piece of shit) and a story that literally hasn't progressed one iota since the first episode.

It's just gonna take most of the blind fans time to wake up to the reality that they are watching a story with no story. For now I guess it's fun for most to be part of the crowd that sees such art, relevance, and genius to this piece of shit saga filled with ugly actors.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Yeah, that's a rational take. I have no reason to want to hate Succession. I'm invested through 30 episodes, if anything I want it to suddenly become good. But they've created a show with absolutely zero characters you want to root for (even the hokey bumpkin Greg the Egg is a piece of shit) and a story that literally hasn't progressed one iota since the first episode.

It's just gonna take most of the blind fans time to wake up to the reality that they are watching a story with no story. For now I guess it's fun for most to be part of the crowd that sees such art, relevance, and genius to this piece of shit saga filled with ugly actors.
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Fair-ish, but if after 30 episodes you dont like something, odds are you wont like it.
 
I'm not expecting it'll change course. If it has this following, they shouldn't mess with the formula, unless people finally start catching on like that article I posted a couple weeks ago. For me, another hour a week for a few months a year while its on is not a big investment anymore. If I knew I'd think it was such shit going into it, I never would've started it though. Another reason I have to watch it is that a client is intimately tied to the show and so it's always a good idea to be familiar with a client's work. I just wish I picked another show he's tied to - Ted Lasso - instead of this junk, but I'm not set up to see Apple on the tv yet.
 
yeah, I mean why would the Leafs spend all the money they have on buyouts and an incredibly costly front office if they don't want to win? This is clearly a waste of precious profits, is it not?

Sure they want to win. but the Leafs drafting and scouting has been bottom of the barrel for decades. that's ultimately why they haven't. it's certainly not Steve Stavro refusing to pay for Wayne Gretzky, and hasn't been for ages. This take on the Leafs is literally decades out of date.

also, today the Leafs are primarily owned by media companies, and those would obviously have more of a vested interest in playoffs than some of the previous owners have. so suggesting that the modern Leaf ownership is of the sort that would turn away a superstar because "meh, it won't make us more money" is obviously ridiculous for that reason alone.
 
Don't Leafs have #1 operational budget as well? Doesn't make sense to the crowd claiming they don't care about winning. That's an epic waste of $ then.
 
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou said:
They didn't TRY to have a bad team for 50 years. And not all their teams were bad. Their biggest impediment to success was always with ownership putting short term profit ahead of on ice success and the front office being incompetent and hiring incompetent coaches and scouts.

I don't care what else a franchise is doing well. If ownership and management only know the cost of everything and the value of nothing that franchise is doomed. Back when Quinn was around the Leafs had a chance to get Gretzky and when it was brought to the Board their only comment was "Meh. How many more tickets would he really sell?" When money matters more than winning Cups you make money and you don't win Cups.

It's no secret why the Habs and Leafs don't win championships anymore. It's because they aren't really trying that hard to win them anymore. The Leafs began not caring a couple of decades earlier than the Habs but the two franchises are today basically the same in the way they approach the business. They like making money and they've both found ways to do that which are not dependent upon how well the team on the ice does. So the on ice product, instead of driving revenue, just becomes a cost of doing business. And like any business these days, companies try to minimize costs to maximize profits.

The teams that win Cups nowadays are the ones who need to win in order to make money, stay relevant, and add to their franchise value. The Habs and Leafs make money hand over fist and the value of their franchises goes only in one direction. And that happens whether they go to the finals or miss the playoffs. They are licenses to print money simply because they exist. They don't have to actually do anything. That's great news if you're a shareholder but not so great news if you're just a fan.
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Actually, it was Cliff Fletcher and not Pat Quinn who made the play for Gretzky. The contract was agreed to and would commence following the season when Gretzky would be a free agent after his tenure with St. Louis. (Quinn didn't sign on with the Leafs until Gretzky's final season.)

Also Stavro's was heavily leveraged with buying the Raptors and building an arena.
 
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