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Leafs/Habs/Sens 2014-15

4 year sample sizes are so hot right now. So hot.

It's not about the 4 years, it's about the fact that 2-6 game sample sizes are useless. Price put up crappy numbers against Ottawa this year while he completely dominated the rest of the league. This year, Price has played crappy against TB, Ottawa, Buffalo, and Chicago. Remove his games against those teams and his save pct is .942 (he had a 1-9-1 record against those 4 teams). Is it something about those teams? Is it mental? Is it dumb luck? I don't know. It's certainly not good news, especially if we want to win a cup we have to beat probably 2, maybe 3 of those 4 teams. But as those stats from 2 years ago show, and all those years of Leafs/Sens series go, what you do in the regular season doesn't necessarily translate to what you do in the playoffs.
 
For the record, I "want" the Sens to win for reasons I've already discussed. I just call out bullshit use of statistics whenever I see it, and this is a bullshit use of statistics.
This board has made it's hay on 2 and 3 year splits.

We are aware that sample size is small - but we're talking about a head-to-head match up. Saying the Sens have had success over recent history is ACCURATE.
 
I addressed that earlier, ****. Laundry doesn't score goals. A number of the goal scorers against Price in that series, are no longer with the Sens.

Strap your drool cup on a little tighter and try to keep up you worthless muppet.

You posted the Stats from the season that happened BEFORE that series and an ENTIRE YEAR EARLIER.

Feel free to explain why the 11/12 and 12/13 stats are relevant and worthy of posting, but the playoff aren't.

I'll wait.
 
This board has made it's hay on 2 and 3 year splits.

Full season data sets...because more data is good up until a point that it just becomes noisy (hockey careers are of very finite length with growth curves involved). When a 2 or 3 year data set is too small to be of use, you utilize other data if it makes sense to do so. You're looking for noise within the numbers, not numbers within the noise.

We are aware that sample size is small - but we're talking about a head-to-head match up. Saying the Sens have had success over recent history is ACCURATE.

Not really. SV% over this small a sample isn't a useful tool for determining individual level of a goalies play. There's too much noise involved that smooths out over larger samples....what noise you ask? Shot quality (PP, etc), QoT.

Basically, you're misusing a tool that you don't understand (SV%) to confirm a bias.
 
Luckily the sens fans I know IRL are good people.

I respect that you would never speak poorly of the mentally ill.

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You posted the Stats from the season that happened BEFORE that series and an ENTIRE YEAR EARLIER.

Feel free to explain why the 11/12 and 12/13 stats are relevant and worthy of posting, but the playoff aren't.

I'll wait.

I was in the process of posting all 7 seasons and said "**** it". It's futile, SV% in these samples are meaningless as a tool for determining a goalie's individual level of play.

FWIW, posting the playoff totals would have added to my point that SV% over such small samples is useless, and fluctuates wildly. Not detracted from it.
 
I was in the process of posting all 7 seasons and said "**** it". It's futile, SV% in these samples are meaningless as a tool for determining a goalie's individual level of play.

So in other words, you massaged the stats to help your case.

Thanks for clarifying.

Disingenuous piece of shit.
 
From one of the statistical luminaries we have arguing this. Please explain to us the value in SV% over a small sample....what value does it provide, what does it actually tell us about the individual performance of a goaltender?
 
From one of the statistical luminaries we have arguing this. Please explain to us the value in SV% over a small sample....what value does it provide, what does it actually tell us about the individual performance of a goaltender?

I am worried about Ottawa (I would probably be worried about the Bruins as well) but Price is not a worry I have.
 
From one of the statistical luminaries we have arguing this. Please explain to us the value in SV% over a small sample....what value does it provide, what does it actually tell us about the individual performance of a goaltender?
It's context. That's it.

It says, "the Sens have had recent success against Montreal and Price". I know that's a radical thought for you to admit, but do try to get your head around it.
 
Yet another moron who doesn't understand what they're talking about.

Not that I expect any better from you to be honest.

I understand that you posted stats as relevant and intentionally left out stats to help your position.

Once called on your BS, you switched arguments.

In other words, typical ME behaviour.
 
Because I'm sick of these morons misusing SV% and I have a bit of time to kill before my flight...


Over a sufficient data set, with relatively good accuracy, it gives us the individual level of play from a goaltender. Why is a sufficient data set necessary? Because too many things not controlled by the goaltender can create statistical noise within the sample. Examples of this would be PP shots on net (typically of better quality), better 5 on 5 shot quality (which have been shown to smooth out when we start looking at sample sizes in the 1000+ shot range). A goalie may face a higher (or lower) proportion of these higher quality shots in smaller data sets and we simply don't have reliable data on shot quality (yet). Larger sample sizes have been shown to smooth out that statistical noise and give us an accurate depiction of that goalies level of play over the larger time period.

If a goalie stops 25 of 30 shots, and that is the only indicator of his performance that we have, what does this tell us about his performance? Honestly...not a **** of a lot. In smaller samples, shot quality is a big deal. Were those 5 flubbers? Were they 5 breakaways? We don't know...so how can that data be useful to us in determining individual performance? If that data can badly skew a small portion of data selected to stand beside that one game, what value does that data set now have? Not a whole **** of a lot. Utilizing SV% in this manner completely invalidates SV%'s ability to act as a good measure of past performance....and...this is key kiddies....as a predictor of future performance. This is where the 2 and 3 full season splits come in to play. When you have a sufficient amount of data, SV% allows us to predict, again with pretty solid accuracy, the future performance of a goalie over another representational data set (typically 1000 shots or more). Keeping in mind that the difference between a .915 and .920 over 1000 shots is 5 goals allowed, SV% does a tremendous job of predicting future performance as the vast majority of goaltenders will be within 5-10 goals per 1000 shots of their most recent 2-3 yrs worth of performance. When you start breaking SV% down into small, meaningless chunks, it loses all ability to act as a quality predictor of future performance.
 
I understand that you posted stats as relevant and intentionally left out stats to help your position.

Except they help my argument, not hinder. You seem to be under the impression that I was using the small sample stats to make a pro Price argument, when I was showing the idiocy of using numbers in that manner. As is entirely consistent with my stance on SV% over the years.

You're playing checkers, and I'm playing chess.
 
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