The Mother-fucking goddamn Off-season Thread

[MindzEye]

I mean....Alex fucking Galchenyuk was a top 6 winger for us in the playoffs that season.

We fucked up.

 

[Montana]

Oh absolutely. But when a guy leaves here, and immediately looks like a NHL player, we fucked up. We were supposed to be the smarter NHL organization that didn't do things like pick busted down 41 yr olds over cheap euro free wallets with 50+ point skill.

He went to a dogshit team and put up 7pts in 9 games….in presumably higher minutes, with better line mates, because he was on a much worse team and could be force fed minutes/opportunities.

I added it as a edit before, but prob too late so I’ll reiterate it here….but he was on a 1 year UFA deal, so was liable to be gone at seasons end anyway. Unless we force fed a guy who had looked like shit, top 6 minutes on a contending team just cause.

Some of its on Barabanov for flashing absolutely nothing in the chances he was given.

 

[Montana]

I mean....Alex fucking Galchenyuk was a top 6 winger for us in the playoffs that season.

We fucked up.

Barabanov 8pts in 22 games.
Galchenyuk 16pts in 32gp.

Galch flashed way more in his time here, than Barabanov did.

 

[Habsy]

Barabanov 8pts in 22 games.
Galchenyuk 16pts in 32gp.

Galch flashed way more in his time here, than Barabanov did.

I believe he's the second or third highest point getter from his draft year. It was just a bad year.

 

[Montana]

We fucked up.

I’d be more apt to agree if we’d had him on a multi year deal, or had he been a RFA at seasons end….but we didn’t have the luxury of keeping pending UFAs around, who were flashing next to nothing.

 

[MindzEye]

Barabanov 8pts in 22 games.
Galchenyuk 16pts in 32gp.

Galch flashed way more in his time here, than Barabanov did.

"in his time here" being the issue.

As soon as Barabanov left he put up 7 points in 9 games and then spend the next 2 seasons being a 50 point player. We were the problem, not him.

 

[Habsy]

Why? I don't get it. I see this shit all day long, every day in my job. Maybe that's why I feel I see through this all so easily, while others are coming up with remote scenarios. From both sides, sometimes I rep the company, and sometimes the individual, but at all times you're always going for the max you can get based on the leverage you think you have.

Here, Dubie thought his worst case was taking the Shanny offer that was on the table, and that his best case was the Leafs advancing far or winning it all and then pushing his demands to the moon. So he waits. He strings Shanny along like the existing offer is all good, he gets the agent to be the buffer so that he's not directly communicating with Shanny about terms so as to get locked into any direct statement, and then lo and behold, the Leafs get to the second round!

Now Shanny approaches him again directly and he's still all non-committal about signing. But then the Leafs lose to Florida, in arguably a close series, but a loss nonetheless, so he only got a slight bit more in the form of talking points for the big ask, but you better believe, he's already been pricing out mansions with the $6M he has in his head that he was certain he'd get if the Leafs went far, and still relatively confident he can still get it they faltered. He certainly thinks public opinion is in his favor, that he has internal support, and that optics of losing the wonderkid that everyone around the league likes, will be too much for the Leafs to risk, especially with Matty and Willy extensions around the corner. But now he doesn't have a second or third round series win to bolster his bargaining position with MLSE. He still wants that extra money though, which is the equivalent of five bucks to the company, that he thinks he's earned after almost ten years of loyal service. So, he's going to go for it anyway.

But he needs a new approach. So, he has to make it look like this high pressure, high visibility job is really taking a toll on the family. Making this great guy have to actually consider maybe giving up his dream job to spare his fam from the rigors of the day to day life of being tied to the Leafs' fortunes. Woe is them. He's already made some noise about this to Shanny, but he needs to up the ante, get the media to put the fear of god into Shanny and the Leafs that he might not return. So he holds the presser that Shanny told him not to hold yet, and then says he doesn't know what he's doing next season. Naturally, he thinks he's covered himself by saying he WON'T go with another team, thereby demonstrating his devotion to the franchise, and keeping that worst case scenario of just signing the existing offer open to fall back on. Enter new, last minute financial demands, which make clear for anyone watching, that family was never a thing, money was. And if he threw something in there about autonomy, then even worse.

Shanny sees right through these antics, loses all respect for the guy, and starts considering a new direction likely from both the now more objective viewpoint on the team's mostly stagnant progress, and personal distaste for his kid protege trying to play him and maybe even plant the seeds for a power grab of some sort. Shanny pulls the rug out from under him, leaving him in shock and fucking embarrassed to have made stupid statements like maybe taking a year off, and Dubie can't hide his anger, as he immediately unfollows the Leafs and Shanny on social media and starts leaking stuff about Board interference being a factor in his hesitation to re-up.

Pittsburgh has its GM job vacant and calls him up for an interview. The Dubas Family somehow gathers itself together to send its representative to meet with the Pens, and boom, back to work next week-ish.

I can't prove it, but this is 99.9% what happened to this point based on all the available information.

I don't think Dubas has the balls to do what you said as evidenced by his presser.

 

[MindzEye]

I’d be more apt to agree if we’d had him on a multi year deal, or had he been a RFA at seasons end….but we didn’t have the luxury of keeping pending UFAs around, who were flashing next to nothing.

It's near impossible to flash anything other than nothing in 8 minutes a night playing with plugs. We gave Galchenyuk, Thornton, Vesey, & Simmonds significantly more opportunity than Barabanov and we were obviously wrong as we've seen since we jettisoned him.

Obviously wrong.

 

[Montana]

obviously hindsight.


sorry but contenders can’t spoon feed guys 17 minutes a night (like shit SJ could) when they show you absolutely nothing in the games you play.

…being a dogshit team has its benefits, and one of them is you can give guys minutes they’d never earn elsewhere and find some hidden gems. Congrats to SJ, they got lucky.

 

[zeke]

He went to a dogshit team and put up 7pts in 9 games….in presumably higher minutes, with better line mates, because he was on a much worse team and could be force fed minutes/opportunities.

I added it as a edit before, but prob too late so I’ll reiterate it here….but he was on a 1 year UFA deal, so was liable to be gone at seasons end anyway. Unless we force fed a guy who had looked like shit, top 6 minutes on a contending team just cause.

Some of its on Barabanov for flashing absolutely nothing in the chances he was given.

just happened too many times. Moore, Barabanov, Marchment, Sandin, and more.

 

[zeke]

obviously hindsight.


sorry but contenders can’t spoon feed guys 17 minutes a night (like shit SJ could) when they show you absolutely nothing in the games you play.

…being a dogshit team has its benefits, and one of them is you can give guys minutes they’d never earn elsewhere and find some hidden gems. Congrats to SJ, they got lucky.

except the Leafs were spoonfeeding minutes to all sorts of worse vets instead.

 

[Montana]

just happened too many times. Moore, Barabanov, Marchment, Sandin, and more.

thats fair….and in those other situations we had much more control.

 

[CH1]

How much is that on the coaching staff — Dubas and his team find them gems that go underdeveloped

 

[Montana]

except the Leafs were spoonfeeding minutes to all sorts of worse vets instead.

….seriously tho, imagine the apoplectic conniption fit everyone here would have been having if dogshit Barabanov (in his Leafs tenure) just started getting high profile opportunities for no reason.

I’m forever optimistic for every Russian we get (was a huge Suglobov hype man…Antropov my favourite Leaf for an era, etc)…..no one wanted to see Barabanov succeed here more than me, but he was shockingly invisible.

again….had we owned some term on him, that’s one thing….but just randomly giving guys top 6 minutes after showing absolutely zilch, just isn’t realistic,

 

[zeke]

….seriously tho, imagine the apoplectic conniption fit everyone here would have been having if dogshit Barabanov (in his Leafs tenure) just started getting high profile opportunities for no reason.

I’m forever optimistic for every Russian we get (was a huge Suglobov hype man…Antropov my favourite Leaf for an era, etc)…..no one wanted to see Barabanov succeed here more than me, but he was shockingly invisible.

again….had we owned some term on him, that’s one thing….but just randomly giving guys top 6 minutes after showing absolutely zilch, just isn’t realistic,

come on his leafs tenure was 13gms at 8mpg. none of us could know that he was actually dogshit or not.

 

[Montana]

come on his leafs tenure was 13gms at 8mpg. none of us could know that he was actually dogshit or not.

he had half a dozen games of 10+ minutes towards the end….he was nothing here. And was pretty unanimously disliked around here for being a nothing, waste of space.

it would be fun to see the receipts from the day he was dealt,

 

[zeke]

he had half a dozen games of 10+ minutes towards the end….he was nothing here. And was pretty unanimously disliked around here for being a nothing, waste of space.

it would be fun to see the receipts from the day he was dealt,

6 games of 10 minutes? I stand corrected.

 

[Preston]

obviously hindsight.


sorry but contenders can’t spoon feed guys 17 minutes a night (like shit SJ could) when they show you absolutely nothing in the games you play.

…being a dogshit team has its benefits, and one of them is you can give guys minutes they’d never earn elsewhere and find some hidden gems. Congrats to SJ, they got lucky.

Actually the Leafs cap structure allows them to give all sorts of unqualified scrubs major opportunities. Why do you think Galchenyuk had great numbers? He had great linemates. There are some open slots to play with some of the best talent in the world. When jimmy Vesey, Galchenyuk, Thornton, kerfoot and other scrubs get all sorts of games up there you have to wonder why they didn't give that same opportunity to a Marchmont or a Barabanov. You know what the other guys are, stop being afraid of trying the guys with actual upside.

 

[Montana]

How much is that on the coaching staff — Dubas and his team find them gems that go underdeveloped

Dubas had apparently been watching him for years, and went hard after him….but again, I’m near positive he had agreements with guys that if they weren’t getting played he’d move them somewhere they could play.

maybe my timeline is off, but I’m pretty sure that was one of the instances.

 

[Montana]

Actually the Leafs cap structure allows them to give all sorts of unqualified scrubs major opportunities. Why do you think Galchenyuk had great numbers? He had great linemates. There are some open slots to play with some of the best talent in the world. When jimmy Vesey, Galchenyuk, Thornton, kerfoot and other scrubs get all sorts of games up there you have to wonder why they didn't give that same opportunity to a Marchmont or a Barabanov. You know what the other guys are, stop being afraid of trying the guys with actual upside.

…..I’m gonna go out on a limb and guess that the guys who played the best in the opportunities given, as well as in practice….were given the opportunities with the big guys.

(and this is overlooking that Barabanov may well have gotten some games in the top 6, and still been shit)


or Keefe knew how good he was, and out of spite refused to give him a chance.