• Moderators, please send me a PM if you are unable to access mod permissions. Thanks, Habsy.

OT: The News Thread

LeafGm said:
I think Count's argument here essentially boils down to: "Don't think for yourself. Don't question authority."
Click to expand...

no, it is called respecting the decision that is made, acknowledging that decisions in court will not always be what you want (even if your wants are ridiculous) and that at the end of the day, there is nothing that can be done other than appealing it and seeing if a higher judge disagrees with the lower court's decision.
 
JohnnyHolmes said:
I think this whole thing needs a little perspective added to the mix.

I am a few years younger than Fleury and Kennedy, and there is no way I would have let my coach jerk off on my feet and blow me when I was 16-17 years old.

Not a chance in hell.

Their continued relationship with the Hitmen, etc... Is just bizarre.

There are many layers to this story that none of us know about. What James did is sick, creepy, abuse of power and surely 100 other things, but what it isn't is pedophilia.
Click to expand...

That is the part that is the weirdest in the entire situation. It is also one few if any journalists will ever have the stones to ask Fleury about. Even if he didn't want to admit he was the second player, he could easily have stated to the GM, no you aren't hiring him. There is nothing to suggest he ever did anything to prevent his molester from getting the job.

Yeah I also don't see it as pedophilia either, they were of legal age albeit he was in a position of trust so the consent issue is not in effect, still they weren't mere tots.
 
corksens said:
Would you agree with it though?
Click to expand...

you cannot answer that question in a vacuum, there are far more facts/issues involved in sentencing. Was the abuser someone who was abused, was he mentally ill, was there violence involved, penetration, effects on the victim, physical injuries, early guilty plea, genuine remorse, was it a one time thing or a long term situation, position of trust or stranger etc
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
no, it is called respecting the decision that is made, acknowledging that decisions in court will not always be what you want (even if your wants are ridiculous) and that at the end of the day, there is nothing that can be done other than appealing it and seeing if a higher judge disagrees with the lower court's decision.
Click to expand...
I think a lot of the time (or all the time), you lose sight of the fact that our laws were written by and are interpreted by fallible human beings who are open to criticism.

I sure as hell won't respect a decision that states that two years in prison is sufficient punishment for a repeat offender using a position of trust to sexually abuse multiple teenage boys. Whether it's consistent with our laws as they're currently written or not, it's absolutely outrageous and something needs to be done about it.
 
JohnnyHolmes said:
I think this whole thing needs a little perspective added to the mix.

I am a few years younger than Fleury and Kennedy, and there is no way I would have let my coach jerk off on my feet and blow me when I was 16-17 years old.

Not a chance in hell.

Their continued relationship with the Hitmen, etc... Is just bizarre.

There are many layers to this story that none of us know about. What James did is sick, creepy, abuse of power and surely 100 other things, but what it isn't is pedophilia.
Click to expand...
Sure, maybe not. It's not something that I could have seen myself doing either. But I don't really see how that mitigates what James did in any way. Every kid in the world may not have fallen victim to him, but sexual predators like James are very good at picking their targets. Get a kid with confidence issues, someone from a broken home, etc. and convince them that the thing they desperately want more than anything in the world (professional hockey career/college scholarship) is something you hold in the palm of your hand...and it's a perfect recipe for the disgusting things James did.
 
The next time a pot smoker, or maybe someone accused of fraud gets more time...that's when we need to make our feelings known. Laws are to govern, not rule, and we do have the power to change things.
 
The age of consent in Canada was 14 until just recently, provided that the older party is not in a position of authority. Which James was to a degree. Hockey coach isn't the same as a police officer or a teacher, but in this case I would accept the argument that James was indeed in a position of authority.

So what do we have here legally? A 25+ year old statutory rape case? One where the accused plead guilty and spared the victims the ordeal of testifying and saved the courts the cost of a trial. For sure those factors were taken into consideration.

Now let's throw a wrench into the gears. What if James was a female billett?

Does any of this happen?
 
Now let's throw a wrench into the gears. What if James was a female billett?

Does any of this happen?
Click to expand...

I've got a better scenario.

What if James' players were female teenage hockey players?

He would have been publicly lynched by an angry mob long ago if that was the case.
 
I tend to think that it's implausible that Fleury was consenting to a degree that would move it from "rape" to "statuatory rape"
 
LeafGm said:
I think a lot of the time (or all the time), you lose sight of the fact that our laws were written by and are interpreted by fallible human beings who are open to criticism.

I sure as hell won't respect a decision that states that two years in prison is sufficient punishment for a repeat offender using a position of trust to sexually abuse multiple teenage boys. Whether it's consistent with our laws as they're currently written or not, it's absolutely outrageous and something needs to be done about it.
Click to expand...

What do you intend to do about it then? Everyone seems to be forgetting the Crown was only seeking 6 years, they weren't seeking a significant term of imprisonment. If he had gotten six, would have that have been enough?
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
That is the part that is the weirdest in the entire situation. It is also one few if any journalists will ever have the stones to ask Fleury about. Even if he didn't want to admit he was the second player, he could easily have stated to the GM, no you aren't hiring him. There is nothing to suggest he ever did anything to prevent his molester from getting the job.

Yeah I also don't see it as pedophilia either, they were of legal age albeit he was in a position of trust so the consent issue is not in effect, still they weren't mere tots.
Click to expand...

it is puzzling why Fleury would associate himself with James, but it is my understanding that James was the founder/GM and coach of the team and he recruited Fleury and some other former players as investers.
 
JohnnyHolmes said:
I think this whole thing needs a little perspective added to the mix.

I am a few years younger than Fleury and Kennedy, and there is no way I would have let my coach jerk off on my feet and blow me when I was 16-17 years old.

Not a chance in hell.

Their continued relationship with the Hitmen, etc... Is just bizarre.

There are many layers to this story that none of us know about. What James did is sick, creepy, abuse of power and surely 100 other things, but what it isn't is pedophilia.
Click to expand...
Research Stokholm Syndrome and remember not everyone is created equal.

Some people are weak. And predators have a way of finding them.
 
TheCountofMonteCristo said:
you cannot answer that question in a vacuum, there are far more facts/issues involved in sentencing. Was the abuser someone who was abused, was he mentally ill, was there violence involved, penetration, effects on the victim, physical injuries, early guilty plea, genuine remorse, was it a one time thing or a long term situation, position of trust or stranger etc
Click to expand...
I'm not asking you in a vacuum though. I'm asking you in the most general sense possible.

Is there any possible circumstance where your son could have been molested and the perpetrator could only serve 2 years and you agree with the sentence.

If yes, then please share.
 
anne25 said:
it is puzzling why Fleury would associate himself with James, but it is my understanding that James was the founder/GM and coach of the team and he recruited Fleury and some other former players as investers.
Click to expand...

Some of the levels of denial and repression the abused can reach are incredible. I've known people to talk up and DO FAVOURS FOR (of a nonsexual sort, that I'm aware of) relatives that abused them for years after abuse, before they get to the point where they can even admit the abuse happened to trusted friends.
 
Yep,
it's hard to understand for most of us looking in, but just like some woman will crawl back to the guy who beat them, sexually abused people must have a whole 'nother level of problems.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top